democracynow--2020-06-12--Angela Davis: Toppling of Confederate Statues Reflects Reckoning with Slavery & Historical Racism

This is a rush transcript .
Copy may not be in its final form .
AMY GOODMAN : I wanted to ask you , Angela Davis , about the monuments to racists , colonizers , Confederates , that are continuing to fall across the United States and around the world .
In St. Paul , Minnesota , Wednesday , activists with the American Indian Movement tied a rope around a statue of Christopher Columbus and pulled it from its pedestal on the state Capitol grounds .
The AIM members then held a ceremony over the fallen monument .
In Massachusetts @ @ @ @ @ @ @ a Columbus statue from a park in Boston ’ s North End , after it was beheaded by protesters early Wednesday morning .
In Richmond , Virginia , protesters toppled a statue of Confederate President Jefferson Davis from Monument Avenue Wednesday night .
In the nearby city of Portsmouth , protesters used sledgehammers to destroy a monument to Confederate soldiers .
One person sustained a serious injury , was hospitalized after a statue fell on his head .
In Washington , D.C. , House Speaker Nancy Pelosi joined other lawmakers demanding the removal @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Statuary Hall in the Capitol .
Meanwhile , President Trump said he will “ not even consider ” renaming U.S. Army bases named after Confederate military officers .
There are 10 such bases , all of them in Southern states .
Trump tweeted Wednesday , “ These Monumental and very Powerful Bases have become part of a Great American Heritage , and a history of Winning , Victory , and Freedom , ” unquote .
Trump ’ s tweet contradicted Defense Secretary Mark Esper and Joint Chiefs of Staff Chair General Mark Milley @ @ @ @ @ @ @ to discussion about renaming the bases .
And a Republican committee in the Senate just voted to rename these bases , like Benning and Bragg and Hood , that are named for Confederate leaders .
Meanwhile , in your hometown of Birmingham , Alabama , Angela , comedian Jermaine Johnson is pleading not guilty to charges of “ inciting a riot ” after he urged protesters at May 31st rally to march on a statue of Charles Linn , a former officer in the Confederate Navy .
Did you think you would ever @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Newsome after the horror at Mother Emanuel Church in Charleston , South Carolina , who shimmied up that flagpole on the grounds of the South Carolina Legislature and took down the Confederate flag , and they put it right on back up .
What about what we ’ re seeing today ?
ANGELA DAVIS : Well , of course , Bree Newsome was a wonderful pioneer .
And I think it ’ s important to link this trend to the campaign in South Africa : “ roads must fall.
” And , of @ @ @ @ @ @ @ extent to which we are being called upon to deeply reflect on the role of historical racisms that have brought us to the point where we are today .
You know , racism should have been immediately confronted in the aftermath of the end of slavery .
This is what Dr. Du Bois ’ s analysis was all about , not so much in terms of , “ Well , what we were going to do about these poor people who have been enslaved so many generations ?
” but , rather , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ in order to guarantee the incorporation of previously enslaved people ?
” Now attention is being turned towards the symbols of slavery , the symbols of colonialism .
And , of course , any campaigns against racism in this country have to address , in the very first place , the conditions of Indigenous people .
I think it ’ s important that we ’ re seeing these demonstrations , but I think at the same time we have to recognize that we can not simply get rid of the history .
We @ @ @ @ @ @ @ that that history has played in charting the trajectory of the United States of America .
And so , I think that these assaults on statues represent an attempt to begin to think through what we have to do to bring down institutions and reenvision them , reorganize them , create new institutions that can attend to the needs of all people .
AMY GOODMAN : And what do you think should be done with statues , for example , to , oh , slaveholding Founding Fathers , like George Washington and Thomas @ @ @ @ @ @ @ you know , museums can play an important educational role .
And I don ’ t think we should get rid of all of the vestiges of the past , but we need to figure out context within which people can understand the nature of U.S. history and the role that racism and capitalism and heteropatriarchy have played in forging that history .
AMY GOODMAN : Can you talk about racism and capitalism ?
You often write and speak about how they are intimately connected .
And talk about a world that you @ @ @ @ @ @ @ racism is integrally linked to capitalism .
And I think it ’ s a mistake to assume that we can combat racism by leaving capitalism in place .
As Cedric Robinson pointed out in his book Black Marxism , capitalism is racial capitalism .
And , of course , to just say for a moment , that Marx pointed out that what he called primitive accumulation , capital doesn ’ t just appear from nowhere .
The original capital was provided by the labor of slaves .
The Industrial Revolution , which pivoted @ @ @ @ @ @ @ enabled by slave labor in the U.S .
So , I am convinced that the ultimate eradication of racism is going to require us to move toward a more socialist organization of our economies , of our other institutions .
I think we have a long way to go before we can begin to talk about an economic system that is not based on exploitation and on the super-exploitation of Black people , Latinx people and other racialized populations .
But I do think that we now have the conceptual means to engage @ @ @ @ @ @ @ capitalism .
Occupy gave us new language .
The notion of the prison-industrial complex requires us to understand the globalization of capitalism .
Anti-capitalist consciousness helps us to understand the predicament of immigrants , who are barred from the U.S. by the wall that has been created by the current occupant .
These conditions have been created by global capitalism .
And I think this is a period during which we need to begin that process of popular education , which will allow people to understand the interconnections of racism , heteropatriarchy , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ do you think we need a truth and reconciliation commission here in this country ?
ANGELA DAVIS : Well , that might be one way to begin , but I know we ’ re going to need a lot more than truth and reconciliation .
But certainly we need truth .
I ’ m not sure how soon reconciliation is going to emerge .
But I think that the whole notion of truth and reconciliation allows us to think differently about the criminal legal system .
It allows us to imagine a form @ @ @ @ @ @ @ revenge , a form of justice that is not retributive .
So I think that those ideas can help us begin to imagine new ways of structuring our institutions , such as — well , not structuring the prison , because the whole point is that we have to abolish that institution in order to begin to envision new ways of addressing the conditions that lead to mass incarceration , that lead to such horrendous tragedies as the murder of George Floyd .
AMY GOODMAN : We ’ re going to come back @ @ @ @ @ @ @ President Trump going to Tulsa on Juneteenth .
We ’ re speaking with Angela Davis , the world-renowned abolitionist , author , activist and professor emerita at University of California , Santa Cruz , author of many books , including Freedom Is a Constant Struggle .
Stay with us .

This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: I wanted to ask you, Angela Davis, about the monuments to racists, colonizers, Confederates, that are continuing to fall across the United States and around the world. In St. Paul, Minnesota, Wednesday, activists with the American Indian Movement tied a rope around a statue of Christopher Columbus and pulled it from its pedestal on the state Capitol grounds. The AIM members then held a ceremony over the fallen monument. In Massachusetts, officials said they’ll remove a Columbus statue from a park in Boston’s North End, after it was beheaded by protesters early Wednesday morning. In Richmond, Virginia, protesters toppled a statue of Confederate President Jefferson Davis from Monument Avenue Wednesday night. In the nearby city of Portsmouth, protesters used sledgehammers to destroy a monument to Confederate soldiers. One person sustained a serious injury, was hospitalized after a statue fell on his head. In Washington, D.C., House Speaker Nancy Pelosi joined other lawmakers demanding the removal of 11 Confederate statues from the National Statuary Hall in the Capitol.
Meanwhile, President Trump said he will “not even consider” renaming U.S. Army bases named after Confederate military officers. There are 10 such bases, all of them in Southern states. Trump tweeted Wednesday, “These Monumental and very Powerful Bases have become part of a Great American Heritage, and a history of Winning, Victory, and Freedom,” unquote. Trump’s tweet contradicted Defense Secretary Mark Esper and Joint Chiefs of Staff Chair General Mark Milley, who suggested they’re open to discussion about renaming the bases. And a Republican committee in the Senate just voted to rename these bases, like Benning and Bragg and Hood, that are named for Confederate leaders.
Meanwhile, in your hometown of Birmingham, Alabama, Angela, comedian Jermaine Johnson is pleading not guilty to charges of “inciting a riot” after he urged protesters at May 31st rally to march on a statue of Charles Linn, a former officer in the Confederate Navy.
Did you think you would ever see this? You think about Bree Newsome after the horror at Mother Emanuel Church in Charleston, South Carolina, who shimmied up that flagpole on the grounds of the South Carolina Legislature and took down the Confederate flag, and they put it right on back up. What about what we’re seeing today?
ANGELA DAVIS: Well, of course, Bree Newsome was a wonderful pioneer. And I think it’s important to link this trend to the campaign in South Africa, Rhodes Must Fall. And, of course, I think this reflects the extent to which we are being called upon to deeply reflect on the role of historical racisms that have brought us to the point where we are today.
You know, racism should have been immediately confronted in the aftermath of the end of slavery. This is what Dr. Du Bois’s analysis was all about, not so much in terms of, “Well, what we were going to do about these poor people who have been enslaved so many generations?” but, rather, “How can we reorganize our society in order to guarantee the incorporation of previously enslaved people?”
Now attention is being turned towards the symbols of slavery, the symbols of colonialism. And, of course, any campaigns against racism in this country have to address, in the very first place, the conditions of Indigenous people. I think it’s important that we’re seeing these demonstrations, but I think at the same time we have to recognize that we cannot simply get rid of the history. We have to recognize the devastatingly negative role that that history has played in charting the trajectory of the United States of America. And so, I think that these assaults on statues represent an attempt to begin to think through what we have to do to bring down institutions and reenvision them, reorganize them, create new institutions that can attend to the needs of all people.
AMY GOODMAN: And what do you think should be done with statues, for example, to, oh, slaveholding Founding Fathers, like George Washington and Thomas Jefferson?
ANGELA DAVIS: Well, you know, museums can play an important educational role. And I don’t think we should get rid of all of the vestiges of the past, but we need to figure out context within which people can understand the nature of U.S. history and the role that racism and capitalism and heteropatriarchy have played in forging that history.
AMY GOODMAN: Can you talk about racism and capitalism? You often write and speak about how they are intimately connected. And talk about a world that you envision.
ANGELA DAVIS: Yeah, racism is integrally linked to capitalism. And I think it’s a mistake to assume that we can combat racism by leaving capitalism in place. As Cedric Robinson pointed out in his book Black Marxism, capitalism is racial capitalism. And, of course, to just say for a moment, that Marx pointed out that what he called primitive accumulation, capital doesn’t just appear from nowhere. The original capital was provided by the labor of slaves. The Industrial Revolution, which pivoted around the production of capital, was enabled by slave labor in the U.S. So, I am convinced that the ultimate eradication of racism is going to require us to move toward a more socialist organization of our economies, of our other institutions. I think we have a long way to go before we can begin to talk about an economic system that is not based on exploitation and on the super-exploitation of Black people, Latinx people and other racialized populations.
But I do think that we now have the conceptual means to engage in discussions, popular discussions, about capitalism. Occupy gave us new language. The notion of the prison-industrial complex requires us to understand the globalization of capitalism. Anti-capitalist consciousness helps us to understand the predicament of immigrants, who are barred from the U.S. by the wall that has been created by the current occupant. These conditions have been created by global capitalism. And I think this is a period during which we need to begin that process of popular education, which will allow people to understand the interconnections of racism, heteropatriarchy, capitalism.
AMY GOODMAN: Angela, do you think we need a truth and reconciliation commission here in this country?
ANGELA DAVIS: Well, that might be one way to begin, but I know we’re going to need a lot more than truth and reconciliation. But certainly we need truth. I’m not sure how soon reconciliation is going to emerge. But I think that the whole notion of truth and reconciliation allows us to think differently about the criminal legal system. It allows us to imagine a form of justice that is not based on revenge, a form of justice that is not retributive. So I think that those ideas can help us begin to imagine new ways of structuring our institutions, such as — well, not structuring the prison, because the whole point is that we have to abolish that institution in order to begin to envision new ways of addressing the conditions that lead to mass incarceration, that lead to such horrendous tragedies as the murder of George Floyd.
AMY GOODMAN: We’re going to come back to this discussion and also talk about President Trump going to Tulsa on Juneteenth. We’re speaking with Angela Davis, the world-renowned abolitionist, author, activist and professor emerita at University of California, Santa Cruz, author of many books, including Freedom Is a Constant Struggle. Stay with us.


democracynow--2020-06-12--Uprising & Abolition: Angela Davis on Movement Building, "Defund the Police" & Where We Go from Here

This is a rush transcript .
Copy may not be in its final form .
AMY GOODMAN : This is Democracy Now !
, democracynow.org , The War and Peace Report , The Quarantine Report .
I ’ m Amy Goodman .
As the nationwide uprising against police brutality and racism continues to roil the nation and the world , bringing down Confederate statues and forcing a reckoning in city halls and on the streets , President Trump defended law enforcement Thursday , dismissing growing calls to defund the police .
He spoke at a campaign-style event at a church @ @ @ @ @ @ @ new executive order advising police departments to adopt national standards for use of force .
Trump did not invite the top three law enforcement officials in Dallas , who are all African American .
The move comes after Trump called protesters ” THUGS ” and threatened to deploy the U.S. military to end , quote , “ riots and lawlessness.
” This is Trump speaking Thursday .
AMY GOODMAN : Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden is also calling for an increase to police funding .
In an op-ed in USA Today , he @ @ @ @ @ @ @ additional $ 300 million to , quote , “ reinvigorate community policing in our country.
” On Wednesday night , Biden discussed police funding on The Daily Show .
AMY GOODMAN : But many argue reform will not fix the inherently racist system of policing .
Since the global protest movement began , Minneapolis has pledged to dismantle its police department , the mayors of Los Angeles and New York City have promised to slash police department budgets , and calls to “ defund the police ” are being heard in spaces that @ @ @ @ @ @ @ weeks ago .
Well , for more on this historic moment , we are spending the hour with the legendary activist and scholar Angela Davis , professor emerita at the University of California , Santa Cruz .
For half a century , Angela Davis has been one of the most influential activists and intellectuals in the United States , an icon of the Black liberation movement .
Angela Davis ’ s work around issues of gender , race , class and prisons has influenced critical thought and social movements across several generations .
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ prison abolition , a position informed by her own experience as a prisoner and a fugitive on the FBI ’ s top 10 wanted list more than 40 years ago .
Once caught , she faced the death penalty in California .
After being acquitted on all charges , she ’ s spent her life fighting to change the criminal justice system .
Angela Davis , welcome back to Democracy Now !
It ’ s great to have you with us today for the hour .
ANGELA DAVIS : Thank you very much @ @ @ @ @ @ @ to be here .
AMY GOODMAN : Well , do you think this moment is a tipping point , a turning point ?
You , who have been involved in activism for almost half a century , do you see this moment as different , perhaps more different than any period of time you have lived through ?
ANGELA DAVIS : Absolutely .
This is an extraordinary moment .
I have never experienced anything like the conditions we are currently experiencing , the conjuncture created by the COVID-19 pandemic and the recognition of @ @ @ @ @ @ @ visible under these conditions because of the disproportionate deaths in Black and Latinx communities .
And this is a moment I don ’ t know whether I ever expected to experience .
When the protests began , of course , around the murder of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor and Ahmaud Arbery and Tony McDade and many others who have lost their lives to racist state violence and vigilante violence — when these protests erupted , I remembered something that I ’ ve said many times to encourage activists , who often feel @ @ @ @ @ @ @ not leading to tangible results .
I often ask them to consider the very long trajectory of Black struggles .
And what has been most important is the forging of legacies , the new arenas of struggle that can be handed down to younger generations .
But I ’ ve often said one never knows when conditions may give rise to a conjuncture such as the current one that rapidly shifts popular consciousness and suddenly allows us to move in the direction of radical change .
If one does not engage in the @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , we can not take advantage of the opportunities to change .
And , of course , this moment will pass .
The intensity of the current demonstrations can not be sustained over time , but we will have to be ready to shift gears and address these issues in different arenas , including , of course , the electoral arena .
AMY GOODMAN : Angela Davis , you have long been a leader of the critical resistance movement , the abolition movement .
And I ’ m wondering if you can explain @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , what you feel needs to be done , around defunding the police , and then around prison abolition .
ANGELA DAVIS : Well , the call to defund the police is , I think , an abolitionist demand , but it reflects only one aspect of the process represented by the demand .
Defunding the police is not simply about withdrawing funding for law enforcement and doing nothing else .
And it appears as if this is the rather superficial understanding that has caused Biden to move in the direction he ’ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ about shifting public funds to new services and new institutions — mental health counselors , who can respond to people who are in crisis without arms .
It ’ s about shifting funding to education , to housing , to recreation .
All of these things help to create security and safety .
It ’ s about learning that safety , safeguarded by violence , is not really safety .
And I would say that abolition is not primarily a negative strategy .
It ’ s not primarily about dismantling , getting rid @ @ @ @ @ @ @ reenvisioning .
It ’ s about building anew .
And I would argue that abolition is a feminist strategy .
And one sees in these abolitionist demands that are emerging the pivotal influence of feminist theories and practices .
ANGELA DAVIS : Well , I want us to see feminism not only as addressing issues of gender , but rather as a methodological approach of understanding the intersectionality of struggles and issues .
Abolition feminism counters carceral feminism , which has unfortunately assumed that issues such as violence against women can be effectively @ @ @ @ @ @ @ using imprisonment as a solution .
And of course we know that Joseph Biden , in 1994 , who claims that the Violence Against Women Act was such an important moment in his career — the Violence Against Women Act was couched within the 1994 Crime Act , the Clinton Crime Act .
And what we ’ re calling for is a process of decriminalization , not — recognizing that threats to safety , threats to security , come not primarily from what is defined as crime , but rather from the failure @ @ @ @ @ @ @ issues of health , issues of violence , education , etc .
So , abolition is really about rethinking the kind of future we want , the social future , the economic future , the political future .
It ’ s about revolution , I would argue .
AMY GOODMAN : You write in Freedom Is a Constant Struggle , “ Neoliberal ideology drives us to focus on individuals , ourselves , individual victims , individual perpetrators .
But how is it possible to solve the massive problem of racist state violence by @ @ @ @ @ @ @ the burden of that history and to assume that by prosecuting them , by exacting our revenge on them , we would have somehow made progress in eradicating racism ?
” So , explain what exactly you ’ re demanding .
ANGELA DAVIS : Well , neoliberal logic assumes that the fundamental unit of society is the individual , and I would say the abstract individual .
According to that logic , Black people can combat racism by pulling themselves up by their own individual bootstraps .
That logic recognizes — or fails @ @ @ @ @ @ @ are institutional barriers that can not be brought down by individual determination .
If a Black person is materially unable to attend the university , the solution is not affirmative action , they argue , but rather the person simply needs to work harder , get good grades and do what is necessary in order to acquire the funds to pay for tuition .
Neoliberal logic deters us from thinking about the simpler solution , which is free education .
I ’ m thinking about the fact that we have been aware of @ @ @ @ @ @ @ least since 1935 — but of course before , but I ’ m choosing 1935 because that was the year when W.E.B .
Du Bois published his germinal Black Reconstruction in America .
And the question was not what should individual Black people do , but rather how to reorganize and restructure post-slavery society in order to guarantee the incorporation of those who had been formerly enslaved .
The society could not remain the same — or should not have remained the same .
Neoliberalism resists change at the individual level .
It @ @ @ @ @ @ @ of capitalism , to conditions of racism .

This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace Report, The Quarantine Report. I’m Amy Goodman. As the nationwide uprising against police brutality and racism continues to roil the nation and the world, bringing down Confederate statues and forcing a reckoning in city halls and on the streets, President Trump defended law enforcement Thursday, dismissing growing calls to defund the police. He spoke at a campaign-style event at a church in Dallas, Texas, announcing a new executive order advising police departments to adopt national standards for use of force. Trump did not invite the top three law enforcement officials in Dallas, who are all African American. The move comes after Trump called protesters ”THUGS” and threatened to deploy the U.S. military to end, quote, “riots and lawlessness.” This is Trump speaking Thursday.
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: They want to get rid of the police forces. They actually want to get rid of it. And that’s what they do, and that’s where they’d go. And you know that, because at the top position, there’s not going to be much leadership. There’s not much leadership left.
Instead, we have to go the opposite way. We must invest more energy and resources in police training and recruiting and community engagement. We have to respect our police. We have to take care of our police. They’re protecting us. And if they’re allowed to do their job, they’ll do a great job. And you always have a bad apple no matter where you go. You have bad apples. And there are not too many of them. And I can tell you there are not too many of them in the police department. We all know a lot of members of the police.
AMY GOODMAN: Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden is also calling for an increase to police funding. In an op-ed in USA Today, he called for police departments to receive an additional $300 million to, quote, “reinvigorate community policing in our country.” On Wednesday night, Biden discussed police funding on The Daily Show.
JOE BIDEN: I don’t believe police should be defunded, but I think the conditions should be placed upon them where departments are having to take significant reforms relating to that. We should set up a national use-of-force standard.
AMY GOODMAN: But many argue reform will not fix the inherently racist system of policing. Since the global protest movement began, Minneapolis has pledged to dismantle its police department, the mayors of Los Angeles and New York City have promised to slash police department budgets, and calls to “defund the police” are being heard in spaces that would have been unthinkable just a few weeks ago.
Well, for more on this historic moment, we are spending the hour with the legendary activist and scholar Angela Davis, professor emerita at the University of California, Santa Cruz. For half a century, Angela Davis has been one of the most influential activists and intellectuals in the United States, an icon of the Black liberation movement. Angela Davis’s work around issues of gender, race, class and prisons has influenced critical thought and social movements across several generations. She’s a leading advocate for prison abolition, a position informed by her own experience as a prisoner and a fugitive on the FBI’s top 10 wanted list more than 40 years ago. Once caught, she faced the death penalty in California. After being acquitted on all charges, she’s spent her life fighting to change the criminal justice system.
Angela Davis, welcome back to Democracy Now! It’s great to have you with us today for the hour.
ANGELA DAVIS: Thank you very much, Amy. It’s wonderful to be here.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, do you think this moment is a tipping point, a turning point? You, who have been involved in activism for almost half a century, do you see this moment as different, perhaps more different than any period of time you have lived through?
ANGELA DAVIS: Absolutely. This is an extraordinary moment. I have never experienced anything like the conditions we are currently experiencing, the conjuncture created by the COVID-19 pandemic and the recognition of the systemic racism that has been rendered visible under these conditions because of the disproportionate deaths in Black and Latinx communities. And this is a moment I don’t know whether I ever expected to experience.
When the protests began, of course, around the murder of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor and Ahmaud Arbery and Tony McDade and many others who have lost their lives to racist state violence and vigilante violence — when these protests erupted, I remembered something that I’ve said many times to encourage activists, who often feel that the work that they do is not leading to tangible results. I often ask them to consider the very long trajectory of Black struggles. And what has been most important is the forging of legacies, the new arenas of struggle that can be handed down to younger generations.
But I’ve often said one never knows when conditions may give rise to a conjuncture such as the current one that rapidly shifts popular consciousness and suddenly allows us to move in the direction of radical change. If one does not engage in the ongoing work when such a moment arises, we cannot take advantage of the opportunities to change. And, of course, this moment will pass. The intensity of the current demonstrations cannot be sustained over time, but we will have to be ready to shift gears and address these issues in different arenas, including, of course, the electoral arena.
AMY GOODMAN: Angela Davis, you have long been a leader of the critical resistance movement, the abolition movement. And I’m wondering if you can explain the demand, as you see it, what you feel needs to be done, around defunding the police, and then around prison abolition.
ANGELA DAVIS: Well, the call to defund the police is, I think, an abolitionist demand, but it reflects only one aspect of the process represented by the demand. Defunding the police is not simply about withdrawing funding for law enforcement and doing nothing else. And it appears as if this is the rather superficial understanding that has caused Biden to move in the direction he’s moving in.
It’s about shifting public funds to new services and new institutions — mental health counselors, who can respond to people who are in crisis without arms. It’s about shifting funding to education, to housing, to recreation. All of these things help to create security and safety. It’s about learning that safety, safeguarded by violence, is not really safety.
And I would say that abolition is not primarily a negative strategy. It’s not primarily about dismantling, getting rid of, but it’s about reenvisioning. It’s about building anew. And I would argue that abolition is a feminist strategy. And one sees in these abolitionist demands that are emerging the pivotal influence of feminist theories and practices.
AMY GOODMAN: Explain that further.
ANGELA DAVIS: Well, I want us to see feminism not only as addressing issues of gender, but rather as a methodological approach of understanding the intersectionality of struggles and issues. Abolition feminism counters carceral feminism, which has unfortunately assumed that issues such as violence against women can be effectively addressed by using police force, by using imprisonment as a solution. And of course we know that Joseph Biden, in 1994, who claims that the Violence Against Women Act was such an important moment in his career — the Violence Against Women Act was couched within the 1994 Crime Act, the Clinton Crime Act.
And what we’re calling for is a process of decriminalization, not — recognizing that threats to safety, threats to security, come not primarily from what is defined as crime, but rather from the failure of institutions in our country to address issues of health, issues of violence, education, etc. So, abolition is really about rethinking the kind of future we want, the social future, the economic future, the political future. It’s about revolution, I would argue.
AMY GOODMAN: You write in Freedom Is a Constant Struggle, “Neoliberal ideology drives us to focus on individuals, ourselves, individual victims, individual perpetrators. But how is it possible to solve the massive problem of racist state violence by calling upon individual police officers to bear the burden of that history and to assume that by prosecuting them, by exacting our revenge on them, we would have somehow made progress in eradicating racism?” So, explain what exactly you’re demanding.
ANGELA DAVIS: Well, neoliberal logic assumes that the fundamental unit of society is the individual, and I would say the abstract individual. According to that logic, Black people can combat racism by pulling themselves up by their own individual bootstraps. That logic recognizes — or fails, rather, to recognize that there are institutional barriers that cannot be brought down by individual determination. If a Black person is materially unable to attend the university, the solution is not affirmative action, they argue, but rather the person simply needs to work harder, get good grades and do what is necessary in order to acquire the funds to pay for tuition. Neoliberal logic deters us from thinking about the simpler solution, which is free education.
I’m thinking about the fact that we have been aware of the need for these institutional strategies at least since 1935 — but of course before, but I’m choosing 1935 because that was the year when W.E.B. Du Bois published his germinal Black Reconstruction in America. And the question was not what should individual Black people do, but rather how to reorganize and restructure post-slavery society in order to guarantee the incorporation of those who had been formerly enslaved. The society could not remain the same — or should not have remained the same. Neoliberalism resists change at the individual level. It asks the individual to adapt to conditions of capitalism, to conditions of racism.


democracynow--2020-06-12--Headlines for June 12, 2020

Headlines for June 12, 2020

In Oklahoma City , newly released police bodycam footage shows the violent arrest of 42-year-old Derrick Scott , who died @ @ @ @ @ Oklahoma City police officers pinned him to the ground with their hands and knees for @ @ @ @ @ he became nonresponsive .
The graphic video shows Scott pleading for his life , repeatedly @ @ @ @ @ t breathe , ” to which one of the officers replies , “ I don @ @ @ @ @ coroner reported the cause of Scott ’ s death was a collapsed lung .
Derrick @ @ @ @ @ Vickey Scott , says the release of the video has reopened old wounds .
Vickey @ @ @ @ @ this all over again is like reliving his death all over again , and then @ @ @ @ @ ’ s a lot of George Floyds , and my son was one of them @ @

In Oklahoma City, newly released police bodycam footage shows the violent arrest of 42-year-old Derrick Scott, who died in May 2019 after three Oklahoma City police officers pinned him to the ground with their hands and knees for 13 minutes — even after he became nonresponsive. The graphic video shows Scott pleading for his life, repeatedly saying “I can’t breathe,” to which one of the officers replies, “I don’t care.”
Derrick Scott: “I can’t breathe!”
Police officer 1: “Stop resisting!”
Derrick Scott: “I can’t breathe! Please! Ma’am, please!”
Police officer 1: “Give me your hand!”
Derrick Scott: “I can’t breathe easy. I got asthma!”
Police officer 2: “Put that here.”
Derrick Scott: “I can’t breathe!”
Police officer 2: “I don’t care!”
A coroner reported the cause of Scott’s death was a collapsed lung. Derrick Scott’s mother, Vickey Scott, says the release of the video has reopened old wounds.


democracynow--2020-06-15--"He Wanted to Hurt Me": New York Protester Hospitalized After NY Officer Shoved Her to the Ground

This is a rush transcript .
Copy may not be in its final form .
AMY GOODMAN : This is Democracy Now !
I ’ m Amy Goodman .
A warning to our viewers : This next story contains graphic footage of police violence .
Yes , we end today ’ s show here in New York City , where police officer Vincent D ’ Andraia has been charged with assault , criminal mischief , harassment and menacing , after video showed him violently shoving a peaceful protester to the ground as he shouted an expletive and a misogynistic slur @ @ @ @ @ @ @ at a protest against police brutality at the Barclays Center in Brooklyn on May 29th when she asked the officer why he was ordering her to get out of the street .
He responded , again , by violently shoving her to the pavement .
A bystander filmed as she was shoved , then rolled onto her side .
She suffered a seizure , was hospitalized with a concussion .
For more , we ’ re joined by that young woman .
Dounya Zayer joins us here in New York , accompanied by @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , who ’ s a civil rights lawyer and candidate for Manhattan district attorney .
We welcome you both to Democracy Now !
Dounya , I ’ m so sorry for what happened to you .
We now have all seen this horrifying video , once again , as this police officer shoves you to the ground , forcing you against the curb .
Your shoes fall off .
Describe that day for us .
What was taking place there ?
DOUNYA ZAYER : I went to the protest on Friday night to @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Matter movement and against police brutality .
The protest was peaceful .
The cops started stampeding towards the crowd .
And I noticed that peaceful protesters were getting hurt .
Like , it was a scene straight out of a horror movie , something that you wouldn ’ t expect .
I knew how important it was to record things like that , so I took my camera out to started recording .
And there ’ s a video on Twitter of the recording that I took , where I ’ m running @ @ @ @ @ @ @ telling us to go to , and I ’ m trying to record while running backwards .
And Officer Vincent D ’ Andraia and his commander , Craig Edelman , they ’ re walking in my direction .
And Vincent D ’ Andraia tells me to move , and I asked , “ Why ?
” while still moving in the direction he was telling me to go to .
And he smacked my phone out of my hand , and then he called me what he called me .
And before I @ @ @ @ @ @ @ myself from the lunge I could see out of my peripheral vision , he shoved me very hard to the ground .
AMY GOODMAN : Now , I ’ m going to show that video of you being shoved , for a particular reason , because we don ’ t like to repeat video , but I want people to be able to see , as he pushes you , he is not alone , as you said .
He ’ s next to a commanding officer .
And many others walk past @ @ @ @ @ @ @ same way we saw happen with Martin Gugino in Buffalo .
And entire , it looked like , battalion walked past him , no one helping .
So , the police officer pushes you down .
You have all these other officers .
Behind him is a white shirt — right ?
— a commanding officer , and they do nothing to help you .
So , can you talk about what happened to you after ?
DOUNYA ZAYER : After I hit my head , I was very confused and shocked .
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
Like , the impact was hard .
And other protesters were trying to help me get up , and they walked me to a nearby stairwell like five feet away .
And I lose my memory at the stairwell , but that ’ s when I had the seizure .
I didn ’ t have the seizure immediately after hitting my head ; it was about five minutes later .
And then I got sent to the hospital in an ambulance , and my memory comes around getting to the hospital .
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ it was unprovoked and not expected , definitely not necessary .
He called me a name .
He wanted to hurt me .
He was angry .
I don ’ t know why .
Maybe he has something against women , he has something against people protesting , something .
But I was backing away from him , and I didn ’ t do anything to him .
And he called me a name , and then he followed through by injuring me .
AMY GOODMAN : I wanted to bring Tahanie Aboushi @ @ @ @ @ @ @ a civil rights attorney .
AMY GOODMAN : Can you talk about the significance of this video ?
Dounya , we asked you before if you minded if we played this .
And can you talk about the effect it has on you , but your feeling about the significance of it ?
I mean , it ’ s unusual — there are so many things going on — that this was captured .
DOUNYA ZAYER : I have a love/hate relationship with the video .
It ’ s important for videos to @ @ @ @ @ @ @ re graphic , even when they ’ re difficult to watch , because we live in a system that does not hold cops accountable .
It takes everything in our power to hold them even 25 % accountable compared to a regular person .
And it ’ s only if you have 100 % proof ; you have to have a video .
They will never , ever , ever punish a police officer for doing wrong unless you have a video .
So I ’ m grateful that the video was taken @ @ @ @ @ @ @ raises awareness on the situation .
I ’ m grateful that it ’ s helping me attempt to get justice on the situation .
But the negative aspect of it is that there ’ s a video of me getting hurt , and people can watch it and laugh at it .
They could enjoy watching me get hurt .
They could have their own opinions on it .
It ’ s difficult to have other people try to tell me that I — to tell me one thing or another regarding me @ @ @ @ @ @ @ difficult to watch it .
I can ’ t watch the video , especially the fact that it has gone as viral as it has .
Again , I ’ m grateful that I ’ m getting an attempt of justice for the video .
But when I ’ m scrolling through social media and I ’ m trying to not find myself being assaulted and then it just shows up right there , it ’ s not enjoyable .
AMY GOODMAN : Which is why we asked you before if it was @ @ @ @ @ @ @ horrifying as it is .
Tahanie Aboushi , can you talk about the significance of what happened to Dounya Zayer and your years of representing people ?
TAHANIE ABOUSHI : Yeah .
So , I ’ ve been doing this work fighting against the use of excessive and deadly force for over 10 years in New York City .
I know the NYPD Patrol Guide very well and how it plays out in the court system .
And video is so important , because it takes a lot to force NYPD to not @ @ @ @ @ @ @ the officers to hold them accountable , but it becomes a he said/she said .
And we understand that in our city , a word of an officer is always taken with much more weight than that of the civilian , especially when they also have the power to arrest .
And so the arrest becomes a question of integrity for the victim , and it ’ s very difficult to piece out in court , which can stretch out over a year or two years ’ time .
But having the video @ @ @ @ @ @ @ what happens , and it records the actions of the officer and allows us to hold them accountable , and to pause it in certain moments and to ask , “ What could you have done differently here ?
” or “ What was the provocation and thought process here ?
” as opposed to it getting jumbled up behind this , “ Oh , it ’ s this massive agency .
We don ’ t know what happened .
It was dark , ” and all these other distractions that take away @ @ @ @ @ @ @ is what the city has shied away from doing .
But I have dedicated my career to holding law enforcement accountable and to getting the city to face these questions from families and from people like Dounya , who now are expected to just go home and act like nothing happened , and live with this trauma for the rest of their life .
AMY GOODMAN : Dounya , what do you want to see happen right now ?
The officer has been charged with various levels of menacing , harassment and assault @ @ @ @ @ @ @ as I know , hasn ’ t been charged .
Is that right ?
DOUNYA ZAYER : Yeah .
Regarding the commanding officer , I feel like a transfer of Commander Craig Edelman was completely inappropriate .
Moving a problem to another community does not solve the problem .
It ’ s not correct .
He clearly is not fit to hold a position where he ’ s supposed to be preventing his officers from doing the wrong thing .
A commander who could watch his lower officers commit a crime , and @ @ @ @ @ @ @ commander .
He should be fired .
He should lose his position .
If anything , he should — you know , it ’ s difficult to go that far , but he should also be charged .
Like , he didn ’ t do anything .
If you ’ re an officer and you could witness an assault , then you ’ re aiding in the assault , as far as I ’ m concerned .
AMY GOODMAN : And various legislative bodies are starting to say if you do not hold @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , will be charged .
DOUNYA ZAYER : Exactly .
And then , with Vincent D ’ Andraia , I don ’ t understand how — you know , like , he was suspended .
I hope that they continue that to fired , because he should — you know , what does his suspension solve ?
Him coming back and being able to do exactly what he did to me again in the future .
There should be no second chances with officers .
There is no — it ’ s not @ @ @ @ @ @ @ the way they ’ ve been treating us and the way they treat Black people worse , way worse .
It ’ s not normal .
We can ’ t justify it .
You can ’ t make excuses for it .
They have to be held accountable immediately .
No suspension .
Fired .
As — AMY GOODMAN : Dounya , we have to go , but I want to thank you so much for being with us .
Dounya Zayer is an activist , shoved by New York police during a @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
Tahanie Aboushi , civil rights attorney , her attorney , running for Manhattan DA , demanding that police be held accountable .
That does it for our broadcast .
Go to democracynow.org for all our stories .
I ’ m Amy Goodman .
Thanks so much for joining us .
Stay safe .

This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now! I’m Amy Goodman. A warning to our viewers: This next story contains graphic footage of police violence. Yes, we end today’s show here in New York City, where police officer Vincent D’Andraia has been charged with assault, criminal mischief, harassment and menacing, after video showed him violently shoving a peaceful protester to the ground as he shouted an expletive and a misogynistic slur at her.
Twenty-year-old Dounya Zayer was at a protest against police brutality at the Barclays Center in Brooklyn on May 29th when she asked the officer why he was ordering her to get out of the street. He responded, again, by violently shoving her to the pavement. A bystander filmed as she was shoved, then rolled onto her side. She suffered a seizure, was hospitalized with a concussion.
For more, we’re joined by that young woman. Dounya Zayer joins us here in New York, accompanied by one of her attorneys, Tahanie Aboushi, who’s a civil rights lawyer and candidate for Manhattan district attorney.
We welcome you both to Democracy Now! Dounya, I’m so sorry for what happened to you. We now have all seen this horrifying video, once again, as this police officer shoves you to the ground, forcing you against the curb. Your shoes fall off. Describe that day for us. What was taking place there?
DOUNYA ZAYER: I went to the protest on Friday night to show my support towards the Black Lives Matter movement and against police brutality. The protest was peaceful. The cops started stampeding towards the crowd. And I noticed that peaceful protesters were getting hurt. Like, it was a scene straight out of a horror movie, something that you wouldn’t expect. I knew how important it was to record things like that, so I took my camera out to started recording. And there’s a video on Twitter of the recording that I took, where I’m running backwards in the direction the officers are telling us to go to, and I’m trying to record while running backwards.
And Officer Vincent D’Andraia and his commander, Craig Edelman, they’re walking in my direction. And Vincent D’Andraia tells me to move, and I asked, “Why?” while still moving in the direction he was telling me to go to. And he smacked my phone out of my hand, and then he called me what he called me. And before I could put my arms up to block myself from the lunge I could see out of my peripheral vision, he shoved me very hard to the ground.
AMY GOODMAN: Now, I’m going to show that video of you being shoved, for a particular reason, because we don’t like to repeat video, but I want people to be able to see, as he pushes you, he is not alone, as you said. He’s next to a commanding officer. And many others walk past you as this happens, in the same way we saw happen with Martin Gugino in Buffalo. And entire, it looked like, battalion walked past him, no one helping. So, the police officer pushes you down. You have all these other officers. Behind him is a white shirt — right? — a commanding officer, and they do nothing to help you. So, can you talk about what happened to you after?
DOUNYA ZAYER: After I hit my head, I was very confused and shocked. I was in a lot of pain. Like, the impact was hard. And other protesters were trying to help me get up, and they walked me to a nearby stairwell like five feet away. And I lose my memory at the stairwell, but that’s when I had the seizure. I didn’t have the seizure immediately after hitting my head; it was about five minutes later. And then I got sent to the hospital in an ambulance, and my memory comes around getting to the hospital.
It was a hard impact. And it was unprovoked and not expected, definitely not necessary. He called me a name. He wanted to hurt me. He was angry. I don’t know why. Maybe he has something against women, he has something against people protesting, something. But I was backing away from him, and I didn’t do anything to him. And he called me a name, and then he followed through by injuring me.
AMY GOODMAN: I wanted to bring Tahanie Aboushi into the conversation. You’re a civil rights attorney.
TAHANIE ABOUSHI: Yes.
AMY GOODMAN: Can you talk about the significance of this video? Dounya, we asked you before if you minded if we played this. And can you talk about the effect it has on you, but your feeling about the significance of it? I mean, it’s unusual — there are so many things going on — that this was captured.
DOUNYA ZAYER: I have a love/hate relationship with the video. It’s important for videos to be taken, even when they’re graphic, even when they’re difficult to watch, because we live in a system that does not hold cops accountable. It takes everything in our power to hold them even 25% accountable compared to a regular person. And it’s only if you have 100% proof; you have to have a video. They will never, ever, ever punish a police officer for doing wrong unless you have a video. So I’m grateful that the video was taken. I’m grateful that it raises awareness on the situation. I’m grateful that it’s helping me attempt to get justice on the situation.
But the negative aspect of it is that there’s a video of me getting hurt, and people can watch it and laugh at it. They could enjoy watching me get hurt. They could have their own opinions on it. It’s difficult to have other people try to tell me that I — to tell me one thing or another regarding me getting assaulted. And it’s difficult to watch it. I can’t watch the video, especially the fact that it has gone as viral as it has. Again, I’m grateful that I’m getting an attempt of justice for the video. But when I’m scrolling through social media and I’m trying to not find myself being assaulted and then it just shows up right there, it’s not enjoyable.
AMY GOODMAN: Which is why we asked you before if it was OK to run your video, and horrifying as it is. Tahanie Aboushi, can you talk about the significance of what happened to Dounya Zayer and your years of representing people?
TAHANIE ABOUSHI: Yeah. So, I’ve been doing this work fighting against the use of excessive and deadly force for over 10 years in New York City. I know the NYPD Patrol Guide very well and how it plays out in the court system. And video is so important, because it takes a lot to force NYPD to not only cooperate and give up identity of the officers to hold them accountable, but it becomes a he said/she said. And we understand that in our city, a word of an officer is always taken with much more weight than that of the civilian, especially when they also have the power to arrest. And so the arrest becomes a question of integrity for the victim, and it’s very difficult to piece out in court, which can stretch out over a year or two years’ time.
But having the video for the world to see clearly memorializes what happens, and it records the actions of the officer and allows us to hold them accountable, and to pause it in certain moments and to ask, “What could you have done differently here?” or “What was the provocation and thought process here?” as opposed to it getting jumbled up behind this, “Oh, it’s this massive agency. We don’t know what happened. It was dark,” and all these other distractions that take away from holding an officer accountable, which is what the city has shied away from doing. But I have dedicated my career to holding law enforcement accountable and to getting the city to face these questions from families and from people like Dounya, who now are expected to just go home and act like nothing happened, and live with this trauma for the rest of their life.
AMY GOODMAN: Dounya, what do you want to see happen right now? The officer has been charged with various levels of menacing, harassment and assault. The commanding officer, as far as I know, hasn’t been charged. Is that right?
TAHANIE ABOUSHI: That’s correct.
DOUNYA ZAYER: Yeah. Regarding the commanding officer, I feel like a transfer of Commander Craig Edelman was completely inappropriate. Moving a problem to another community does not solve the problem. It’s not correct. He clearly is not fit to hold a position where he’s supposed to be preventing his officers from doing the wrong thing. A commander who could watch his lower officers commit a crime, and do nothing, should not be a commander. He should be fired. He should lose his position. If anything, he should — you know, it’s difficult to go that far, but he should also be charged. Like, he didn’t do anything. If you’re an officer and you could witness an assault, then you’re aiding in the assault, as far as I’m concerned.
AMY GOODMAN: And various legislative bodies are starting to say if you do not hold another officer accountable, you, too, will be charged.
DOUNYA ZAYER: Exactly. And then, with Vincent D’Andraia, I don’t understand how — you know, like, he was suspended. I hope that they continue that to fired, because he should — you know, what does his suspension solve? Him coming back and being able to do exactly what he did to me again in the future. There should be no second chances with officers. There is no — it’s not acceptable. We can’t normalize the way they’ve been treating us and the way they treat Black people worse, way worse. It’s not normal. We can’t justify it. You can’t make excuses for it. They have to be held accountable immediately. No suspension. Fired. As —
AMY GOODMAN: Dounya, we have to go, but I want to thank you so much for being with us. Dounya Zayer is an activist, shoved by New York police during a recent anti-police protest in New York City. Tahanie Aboushi, civil rights attorney, her attorney, running for Manhattan DA, demanding that police be held accountable.
That does it for our broadcast. Go to democracynow.org for all our stories. I’m Amy Goodman. Thanks so much for joining us. Stay safe.


democracynow--2020-06-15--Police Anti-Bias Trainer Shot in Groin by San Jose Cops at Protest: "It's Clear This Isn't Working"

This is a rush transcript .
Copy may not be in its final form .
AMY GOODMAN : This is Democracy Now !
, democracynow.org , The Quarantine Report .
I ’ m Amy Goodman , as we turn now to look at police violence against protesters who have taken to the streets following the Minneapolis police killing of George Floyd three weeks ago .
Across the country , activists have been beaten , tear-gassed , maced , shot , arrested en masse .
Nonviolent protesters and journalists alike have lost eyes , been rammed by cars and trucks , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ ’ re going to San Jose , California , where police shot their own anti-bias trainer in the groin with a rubber-coated steel ball bullet , bursting his testicle .
Derrick Sanderlin is 27 years old , African American .
He spent years training police cadets in San Jose about how to avoid implicit bias toward people of color .
He was shot while taking part in a protest on May 29th .
San Jose Police Chief Eddie Garcia has released a statement saying Sanderlin , quote , “ has been a real @ @ @ @ @ @ @ reduce bias and discrimination through dialogue , ” unquote , and vowed to investigate .
But Garcia has also defended the use of force by his officers during the recent protests .
Derrick Sanderlin joins us now from San Jose .
We welcome you to Democracy Now !
You ’ re an anti-bias trainer with the Future of Justice Training , a San Jose community organizer .
Thanks so much for being with us .
I ’ m so sorry for what has happened to you .
Can you go back to that @ @ @ @ @ @ @ killing of George Floyd , and tell us what happened ?
Set the scene for us , Derrick .
DERRICK SANDERLIN : Absolutely , yeah .
We were starting to gather at City Hall .
And I ’ ve got to say , I really wasn ’ t sure how many people were going to be there .
I think , following the death of another Black — a Black person in America , the protest in San Jose was like one of the biggest I ’ ve ever seen here in this @ @ @ @ @ @ @ to see .
It was very peaceful , even as we started to cause some disruption in traffic .
Cars were honking along with us and rooting us on .
We blocked the freeway , which is when police started to sort of show up .
And as tensions started to rise , there was an increasing need to just like quell the tension between police officers and community members , particularly when , on our way back to City Hall , the police department decided to sort of follow behind us in @ @ @ @ @ @ @ firing rubber bullets into the crowd .
I , yeah , saw old women being shot , kids being shot and , you know , just a continued push toward City Hall .
AMY GOODMAN : So , Derrick , tell us what you did then .
You put your hands up and walked between — AMY GOODMAN : — the protesters and the police ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : Precisely .
So , as I was watching a young woman get shot by a rubber bullet directly in the chest , I just @ @ @ @ @ @ @ just kind of put my hands up and walked sideways over there , as they were searching around , and asked them to please not do this .
And , you know , they were sort of , you know , at bay for the moment .
And as I was continuing to say just , you know , “ Please don ’ t do this , ” another cop came up from behind them and pointed his riot gun right at me and said , “ Move.
” And I just kind @ @ @ @ @ @ @ and , with a lot of fear , was just kind of shaking my head no .
And he said , “ You ’ re not going to move ?
” And I just kind of stood there .
And he fired his riot gun .
And I didn ’ t realize until impact that he had been aiming at my groin .
And yeah , I fell to the ground , but luckily there were a couple people who I knew who were standing nearby when everything unfolded , and I was @ @ @ @ @ @ @ way after that .
AMY GOODMAN : So you were taken to the hospital ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : I actually didn ’ t go to the hospital that night , even though it was the worst pain that I ’ ve ever experienced .
I figured , you know , ice and sleep it off , I ’ ll be OK .
These things happen , you know .
But the pain got worse , and the condition got worse .
And I just — I called my doctor , and they sort @ @ @ @ @ @ @ test , and if things get worse , that I go into the hospital .
So , I did that Saturday night .
And they discovered that there ’ s a strong possibility that I had a ruptured testicle .
So I went into emergency surgery Saturday night and went home Sunday morning .
AMY GOODMAN : And what is your prognosis ?
What did the doctor say ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : So , after the emergency surgery , there was a ruptured testicle .
But , yeah , right before the surgery @ @ @ @ @ @ @ is ruptured , there ’ s a possibility that having kids can be complicated .
You can — your body can create an antibody against yourself .
And yeah , you won ’ t know until you try , but there ’ s a possibility that you may not be able to have children.
” AMY GOODMAN : Have you been talking with your partner about having kids ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : Yes .
We actually , a couple weeks before the protests , were sort of planning , you know , when @ @ @ @ @ @ @ about having kids .
So , definitely a desire .
AMY GOODMAN : I wanted to ask you about the San Jose police chief , Eddie Garcia , personally calling you after you were shot , and then releasing the statement saying , “ Derrick has been a real leader in our communities ’ efforts to reduce bias and discrimination through dialogue .
I assured him we will be investigating this incident , ” he said .
However , in the past he has defended his officers ’ conduct during protests , and @ @ @ @ @ @ @ policing the streets during protests to being in a , quote , “ war zone.
” Now , the fact that you are an anti-bias trainer of the San Jose Police Department , can you explain the work you ’ ve been doing for years there ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : Yes .
So , we are — I belong to a team called the Beloved Community .
We ’ re community organizers .
And one of the particular things that we do in our work for police accountability is talk to police officers @ @ @ @ @ @ @ policing that they step into when they put on their uniform .
And in doing so , they are also opening what we like to call a bank account at the Community Bank of Trust .
And , you know , you can either make deposits or withdrawals from that Community Bank of Trust , but you have to make that choice consciously .
And whether you like it or not , folks are sort of engaging with you based on their historical and cultural context with policing and law enforcement .
And @ @ @ @ @ @ @ for cadets and officers who have to retake the class or who haven ’ t taken the class in the past .
AMY GOODMAN : Derrick , did you know any of the officers on the line ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : Unfortunately , I couldn ’ t pick them out , you know , but — AMY GOODMAN : Were they fully covered with shields ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : They were covered with — they didn ’ t have the riot shields , but they did have the face — the plastic face @ @ @ @ @ @ @ some of them have been on the force for years , and some of them I ’ m just like not familiar with .
But — AMY GOODMAN : And your response to the police chief calling you directly , Police Chief Garcia , and yet — rather , the mayor [ sic ] calling you directly , and the police [ captain ] calling the area a “ war zone ” ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : Unfortunately , the conversation that the community has been having out here is , if our public @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , the 30th and the 31st as a war zone , then it sort of assumes that someone — that our community is being — you know , that the war is between the community and the police , which is a strange way to paint the community that you ’ re called to serve .
I respect the chief a lot .
And I do know that — AMY GOODMAN : Sorry , I misidentified .
The chief is Eddie Garcia ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : Chief Garcia .
I do — yeah @ @ @ @ @ @ @ respect the mayor .
It ’ s clear that this isn ’ t working .
And it ’ s disappointing to continue to hear , yeah , anything less than “ Let ’ s try to move forward in the transformation.
” AMY GOODMAN : What do you demand of the police department right now ?
DERRICK SANDERLIN : I have been holding a lot tension over the years with a lot of the deaths that have happened in the city .
I think it ’ s high time that we listen to @ @ @ @ @ @ @ and defund the police department , divest from school cops and internal investigations , things like this , in order to reinvest into the community , have better school programs , have a strengthened civilian oversight that ’ s independent from the police department .
And just really , I ’ m asking my city officials to listen to their community when we say we need to reimagine public safety .
AMY GOODMAN : And your thoughts when you heard that Rayshard Brooks had been killed now in Atlanta , like you , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ SANDERLIN : Yeah , that seriously — that seriously broke my heart , especially given some of the words from Killer Mike .
I ’ ve never been to Atlanta .
I don ’ t know anything about Atlanta .
But I have heard of the Mecca , and so it ’ s difficult to hear .
And what ’ s even more difficult to hear is the death of Christopher Booker , the alleged lynching .
I grew up in Victorville , California is my state , and so , familiar with @ @ @ @ @ @ @ And I hope this wakes the country up .
AMY GOODMAN : Well , Derrick , I want to thank you so much for being with us .
And also , just to clarify , since I misidentified them , the police chief of San Jose is Eddie Garcia , and it ’ s the San Jose police captain , who ’ s Jason Dwyer — AMY GOODMAN : Derrick Sanderlin , thanks so much for being with us , anti-bias trainer with Future of Justice Training and a San Jose community organizer @ @ @ @ @ @ @ we come back , a New York police officer is charged with assault , criminal mischief , harassment and menacing for violently shoving a 20-year-old woman at a recent protest against police brutality .
She was hospitalized with a concussion .
We ’ ll speak with Dounya Zayer and her attorney .
Stay with us .

This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The Quarantine Report. I’m Amy Goodman, as we turn now to look at police violence against protesters who have taken to the streets following the Minneapolis police killing of George Floyd three weeks ago. Across the country, activists have been beaten, tear-gassed, maced, shot, arrested en masse. Nonviolent protesters and journalists alike have lost eyes, been rammed by cars and trucks, suffered broken limbs.
Well, we’re going to San Jose, California, where police shot their own anti-bias trainer in the groin with a rubber-coated steel ball bullet, bursting his testicle. Derrick Sanderlin is 27 years old, African American. He spent years training police cadets in San Jose about how to avoid implicit bias toward people of color. He was shot while taking part in a protest on May 29th. San Jose Police Chief Eddie Garcia has released a statement saying Sanderlin, quote, “has been a real leader in our communities’ efforts to reduce bias and discrimination through dialogue,” unquote, and vowed to investigate. But Garcia has also defended the use of force by his officers during the recent protests. Derrick Sanderlin joins us now from San Jose.
We welcome you to Democracy Now! You’re an anti-bias trainer with the Future of Justice Training, a San Jose community organizer. Thanks so much for being with us. I’m so sorry for what has happened to you. Can you go back to that day, to the protests after the killing of George Floyd, and tell us what happened? Set the scene for us, Derrick.
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Absolutely, yeah. We were starting to gather at City Hall. And I’ve got to say, I really wasn’t sure how many people were going to be there. I think, following the death of another Black — a Black person in America, the protest in San Jose was like one of the biggest I’ve ever seen here in this city. And so it was beautiful to see. It was very peaceful, even as we started to cause some disruption in traffic. Cars were honking along with us and rooting us on. We blocked the freeway, which is when police started to sort of show up.
And as tensions started to rise, there was an increasing need to just like quell the tension between police officers and community members, particularly when, on our way back to City Hall, the police department decided to sort of follow behind us in a line of police officers and start firing rubber bullets into the crowd. I, yeah, saw old women being shot, kids being shot and, you know, just a continued push toward City Hall.
AMY GOODMAN: So, Derrick, tell us what you did then. You put your hands up and walked between —
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Yeah.
AMY GOODMAN: — the protesters and the police?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Precisely. So, as I was watching a young woman get shot by a rubber bullet directly in the chest, I just couldn’t watch anymore. I just kind of put my hands up and walked sideways over there, as they were searching around, and asked them to please not do this. And, you know, they were sort of, you know, at bay for the moment.
And as I was continuing to say just, you know, “Please don’t do this,” another cop came up from behind them and pointed his riot gun right at me and said, “Move.” And I just kind of pulled my sign over my chest and, with a lot of fear, was just kind of shaking my head no. And he said, “You’re not going to move?” And I just kind of stood there. And he fired his riot gun.
And I didn’t realize until impact that he had been aiming at my groin. And yeah, I fell to the ground, but luckily there were a couple people who I knew who were standing nearby when everything unfolded, and I was luckily taken away from harm’s way after that.
AMY GOODMAN: So you were taken to the hospital?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: I actually didn’t go to the hospital that night, even though it was the worst pain that I’ve ever experienced. I figured, you know, ice and sleep it off, I’ll be OK. These things happen, you know. But the pain got worse, and the condition got worse. And I just — I called my doctor, and they sort of suggested that I take a radiology test, and if things get worse, that I go into the hospital. So, I did that Saturday night. And they discovered that there’s a strong possibility that I had a ruptured testicle. So I went into emergency surgery Saturday night and went home Sunday morning.
AMY GOODMAN: And what is your prognosis? What did the doctor say?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: So, after the emergency surgery, there was a ruptured testicle. But, yeah, right before the surgery, he said, “If it is ruptured, there’s a possibility that having kids can be complicated. You can — your body can create an antibody against yourself. And yeah, you won’t know until you try, but there’s a possibility that you may not be able to have children.”
AMY GOODMAN: Have you been talking with your partner about having kids?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Yes. We actually, a couple weeks before the protests, were sort of planning, you know, when we’re going to start thinking about having kids. So, definitely a desire.
AMY GOODMAN: I wanted to ask you about the San Jose police chief, Eddie Garcia, personally calling you after you were shot, and then releasing the statement saying, “Derrick has been a real leader in our communities’ efforts to reduce bias and discrimination through dialogue. I assured him we will be investigating this incident,” he said. However, in the past he has defended his officers’ conduct during protests, and San Jose Police Captain Jason Dwyer compared policing the streets during protests to being in a, quote, “war zone.” Now, the fact that you are an anti-bias trainer of the San Jose Police Department, can you explain the work you’ve been doing for years there?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Yes. So, we are — I belong to a team called the Beloved Community. We’re community organizers. And one of the particular things that we do in our work for police accountability is talk to police officers about the cultural and historical history of policing that they step into when they put on their uniform. And in doing so, they are also opening what we like to call a bank account at the Community Bank of Trust. And, you know, you can either make deposits or withdrawals from that Community Bank of Trust, but you have to make that choice consciously. And whether you like it or not, folks are sort of engaging with you based on their historical and cultural context with policing and law enforcement. And that’s essentially what we do for cadets and officers who have to retake the class or who haven’t taken the class in the past.
AMY GOODMAN: Derrick, did you know any of the officers on the line?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Unfortunately, I couldn’t pick them out, you know, but —
AMY GOODMAN: Were they fully covered with shields?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: They were covered with — they didn’t have the riot shields, but they did have the face — the plastic face masks. And yeah, unfortunately, some of them have been on the force for years, and some of them I’m just like not familiar with. But —
AMY GOODMAN: And your response to the police chief calling you directly, Police Chief Garcia, and yet — rather, the mayor [sic] calling you directly, and the police [captain] calling the area a “war zone”?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Unfortunately, the conversation that the community has been having out here is, if our public officials perceive what happened on the 29th, the 30th and the 31st as a war zone, then it sort of assumes that someone — that our community is being — you know, that the war is between the community and the police, which is a strange way to paint the community that you’re called to serve. I respect the chief a lot. And I do know that —
AMY GOODMAN: Sorry, I misidentified. The chief is Eddie Garcia?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Yes, that’s right.
AMY GOODMAN: Yes.
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Chief Garcia. I do — yeah, I do respect Chief Garcia and respect the mayor. It’s clear that this isn’t working. And it’s disappointing to continue to hear, yeah, anything less than “Let’s try to move forward in the transformation.”
AMY GOODMAN: What do you demand of the police department right now?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: I have been holding a lot tension over the years with a lot of the deaths that have happened in the city. I think it’s high time that we listen to the families that have experienced that, and defund the police department, divest from school cops and internal investigations, things like this, in order to reinvest into the community, have better school programs, have a strengthened civilian oversight that’s independent from the police department. And just really, I’m asking my city officials to listen to their community when we say we need to reimagine public safety.
AMY GOODMAN: And your thoughts when you heard that Rayshard Brooks had been killed now in Atlanta, like you, a 27-year-old African American man?
DERRICK SANDERLIN: Yeah, that seriously — that seriously broke my heart, especially given some of the words from Killer Mike. I’ve never been to Atlanta. I don’t know anything about Atlanta. But I have heard of the Mecca, and so it’s difficult to hear.
And what’s even more difficult to hear is the death of Christopher Booker, the alleged lynching. I grew up in Victorville, California is my state, and so, familiar with the presence of just devastating bias. And I hope this wakes the country up.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, Derrick, I want to thank you so much for being with us. And also, just to clarify, since I misidentified them, the police chief of San Jose is Eddie Garcia, and it’s the San Jose police captain, who’s Jason Dwyer —
DERRICK SANDERLIN: That’s correct.
AMY GOODMAN: — who called the protest zone a “war zone.”
DERRICK SANDERLIN: That’s correct.
AMY GOODMAN: Derrick Sanderlin, thanks so much for being with us, anti-bias trainer with Future of Justice Training and a San Jose community organizer. Thanks for joining us.
When we come back, a New York police officer is charged with assault, criminal mischief, harassment and menacing for violently shoving a 20-year-old woman at a recent protest against police brutality. She was hospitalized with a concussion. We’ll speak with Dounya Zayer and her attorney. Stay with us.