npr--2020-12-21--Vatican OKs Receiving COVID-19 Vaccines, Even If Research Involved Fetal Tissue

The Vatican says that it 's `` morally acceptable '' to receive a vaccination for COVID-19 , even if the vaccine 's research or production involved using cell lines derived from aborted fetuses , given the `` grave danger '' of the pandemic .
The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith , the Vatican office charged with promoting and defending church morals and traditions , said in a document released Monday that `` when ethically irreproachable Covid-19 vaccines are not available ... it is morally acceptable to receive Covid-19 vaccines that have used cell lines from aborted fetuses in @ @ @ @ @ @ @ The statement said that `` all vaccinations recognized as clinically safe and effective can be used in good conscience with the certain knowledge that the use of such vaccines does not constitute formal cooperation with the abortion from which the cells used in production of the vaccines derive .
It should be emphasized , however , that the morally licit use of these types of vaccines , in the particular conditions that make it so , does not in itself constitute a legitimation , even indirect , of the practice of abortion , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ practice by those who make use of these vaccines . ''
The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops released its own statement last week , which said : `` In view of the gravity of the current pandemic and the lack of availability of alternative vaccines , the reasons to accept the new COVID-19 vaccines from Pfizer and Moderna are sufficiently serious to justify their use , '' as it deemed these vaccines ' connection to abortion `` very remote . ''
The U.S. conference said that receiving one of the vaccines `` ought @ @ @ @ @ @ @ charity toward the other members of our community '' and `` considered an act of love of our neighbor and part of our moral responsibility for the common good . ''
NPR reached out to Pfizer , Moderna and AstraZeneca for comment but did not receive a reply by time of publication .
The Vatican statement did not cite by name any COVID-19 vaccines now in use or development .
Cells derived from elective abortions have been used in the manufacture of vaccines since the 1960s , Science magazine reported , `` including @ @ @ @ @ @ @ hepatitis A , and shingles .
They have also been used to make approved drugs against diseases including hemophilia , rheumatoid arthritis , and cystic fibrosis . ''

Vatican OKs Receiving COVID-19 Vaccines, Even If Research Involved Fetal Tissue
Enlarge this image toggle caption Andrew Medichini/AP Andrew Medichini/AP
The Vatican says that it's "morally acceptable" to receive a vaccination for COVID-19, even if the vaccine's research or production involved using cell lines derived from aborted fetuses, given the "grave danger" of the pandemic.
The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the Vatican office charged with promoting and defending church morals and traditions, said in a document released Monday that "when ethically irreproachable Covid-19 vaccines are not available ... it is morally acceptable to receive Covid-19 vaccines that have used cell lines from aborted fetuses in their research and production process."
Pope Francis approved the text on Thursday, Vatican News reported.
The statement said that "all vaccinations recognized as clinically safe and effective can be used in good conscience with the certain knowledge that the use of such vaccines does not constitute formal cooperation with the abortion from which the cells used in production of the vaccines derive. It should be emphasized, however, that the morally licit use of these types of vaccines, in the particular conditions that make it so, does not in itself constitute a legitimation, even indirect, of the practice of abortion, and necessarily assumes the opposition to this practice by those who make use of these vaccines."
The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops released its own statement last week, which said: "In view of the gravity of the current pandemic and the lack of availability of alternative vaccines, the reasons to accept the new COVID-19 vaccines from Pfizer and Moderna are sufficiently serious to justify their use," as it deemed these vaccines' connection to abortion "very remote."
The U.S. conference said that receiving one of the vaccines "ought to be understood as an act of charity toward the other members of our community" and "considered an act of love of our neighbor and part of our moral responsibility for the common good."
NPR reached out to Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZeneca for comment but did not receive a reply by time of publication. The Vatican statement did not cite by name any COVID-19 vaccines now in use or development.
Cells derived from elective abortions have been used in the manufacture of vaccines since the 1960s, Science magazine reported, "including current vaccines against rubella, chickenpox, hepatitis A, and shingles. They have also been used to make approved drugs against diseases including hemophilia, rheumatoid arthritis, and cystic fibrosis."


npr--2020-12-21--What We Know About Russia's Alleged Hack Of The U.S. Government And Tech Companies

What We Know About Russia 's Alleged Hack Of The U.S. Government And Tech Companies A massive computer breach allowed hackers to spend months exploring numerous U.S. government networks and private companies ' systems around the world .
Industry experts say a country mounted the complex hack — and government officials say Russia is responsible .
The hackers attached their malware to a software update from SolarWinds , a company based in Austin , Texas .
Many federal agencies and thousands of companies worldwide use SolarWinds ' Orion software to monitor their computer networks .
SolarWinds says that nearly 18,000 @ @ @ @ @ @ @ and the private sector — received the tainted software update from March to June of this year .
Here 's what we know about the attack : Russia 's foreign intelligence service , the SVR , is believed to have carried out the hack , according to cybersecurity experts who cite the extremely sophisticated nature of the attack .
Russia has denied involvement .
President Trump has been silent about the hack and his administration has not attributed blame .
However , U.S. intelligence agencies have started briefing members of Congress , and @ @ @ @ @ @ @ 've seen points toward Russia .
Included are members of the Senate Armed Services Committee , where Chairman James Inhofe , a Republican from Oklahoma , and the top Democrat on the panel , Jack Reed of Rhode Island , issued a joint statement Thursday saying `` the cyber intrusion appears to be ongoing and has the hallmarks of a Russian intelligence operation . ''
After several days of saying relatively little , the U.S. Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency on Thursday delivered an ominous warning , saying the hack `` poses a @ @ @ @ @ @ @ and local governments as well as private companies and organizations .
In addition , CISA said that removing the malware will be `` highly complex and challenging for organizations . ''
The episode is the latest in what has become a long list of suspected Russian electronic incursions into other nations under President Vladimir Putin .
Multiple countries have previously accused Russia of using hackers , bots and other means in attempts to influence elections in the U.S. and elsewhere .
U.S. national security agencies made major efforts to prevent Russia from interfering @ @ @ @ @ @ @ same agencies seem to have been blindsided by the hackers who have had months to dig around inside U.S. government systems .
`` It 's as if you wake up one morning and suddenly realize that a burglar has been going in and out of your house for the last six months , '' said Glenn Gerstell , who was the National Security Agency 's general counsel from 2015 to 2020 .
So far , the list of affected U.S. government entities reportedly includes the Commerce Department , the Department of Homeland Security @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , the U.S .
Postal Service and the National Institutes of Health .
The Department of Energy acknowledged its computer systems had been compromised , though it said malware was `` isolated to business networks only , and has not impacted the mission essential national security functions of the Department , including the National Nuclear Security Administration . ''
SolarWinds has some 300,000 customers , but it said `` fewer than 18,000 '' installed the version of its Orion products that appears to have been compromised .
The victims include government , consulting @ @ @ @ @ @ @ in North America , Europe , Asia and the Middle East , according to the security firm FireEye , which helped raise the alarm about the breach .
After studying the malware , FireEye said it believes the breaches were carefully targeted : `` These compromises are not self-propagating ; each of the attacks require meticulous planning and manual interaction . ''
Microsoft , which is helping investigate the hack , says it identified 40 government agencies , companies and think tanks that have been infiltrated .
While more than 30 victims are @ @ @ @ @ @ @ hit in Canada , Mexico , Belgium , Spain , the United Kingdom , Israel and the United Arab Emirates .
`` The attack unfortunately represents a broad and successful espionage-based assault on both the confidential information of the U.S. government and the tech tools used by firms to protect them , '' Microsoft 's President Brad Smith wrote .
`` While governments have spied on each other for centuries , the recent attackers used a technique that has put at risk the technology supply chain for the broader economy , '' he @ @ @ @ @ @ @ ?
Hackers exploited the way software companies distribute updates , adding malware to the legitimate package .
Security analysts said the malicious code gave hackers a `` backdoor '' — a foothold in their targets ' computer networks — which they then used to gain elevated credentials .
SolarWinds traced the `` supply chain '' attack to updates for its Orion network products between March and June .
`` After an initial dormant period of up to two weeks , it retrieves and executes commands , called 'Jobs , ' that include the @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , profile the system , reboot the machine , and disable system services , '' FireEye said .
The malware was engineered to be stealthy , operating in ways that would masquerade as normal activity , FireEye said .
It added that the malicious software could also identify forensic and anti-virus tools that might threaten it .
And it said the credentials it used to move within the system were `` always different from those used for remote access . ''
After gaining access , Microsoft said , the intruder also made changes @ @ @ @ @ @ @ new credentials and using administrator privileges to grant itself more permissions .
FireEye is calling the `` Trojanized '' SolarWinds software Sunburst .
It named another piece of malware – which it said had never been seen before — TEARDROP .
What are investigators doing now ?
SolarWinds said it is cooperating with the FBI , the U.S. intelligence community and other investigating agencies to learn more about the malware and its effects .
The company and security firms also said any affected agencies or customers should update to the latest software to @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Microsoft has now taken control of the domain name that hackers used to communicate with systems that were compromised by the Orion update , according to security expert Brian Krebs .
That access can help reveal the scope of the hack , he said .
What 's next for the agencies and companies that were hacked ?
Kevin Mandia , CEO of FireEye , told NPR that as companies and agencies learn they 've been compromised , there 's much to do : They must investigate the scale and scope of the attack @ @ @ @ @ @ @ network if they 're still active .
Even if they 're not still active , he predicts months of remediation ahead .
For the U.S. government , Mandia says , there are bigger questions to be addressed — including a doctrine on what the U.S. expects nations ' rules of engagement to be , and what the response will be to those who violate that doctrine .
This story was first published Dec. 15 and has been updated .

What We Know About Russia's Alleged Hack Of The U.S. Government And Tech Companies
Enlarge this image toggle caption Bill Clark/CQ-Roll Call, Inc via Getty Imag Bill Clark/CQ-Roll Call, Inc via Getty Imag
A massive computer breach allowed hackers to spend months exploring numerous U.S. government networks and private companies' systems around the world. Industry experts say a country mounted the complex hack — and government officials say Russia is responsible.
The hackers attached their malware to a software update from SolarWinds, a company based in Austin, Texas. Many federal agencies and thousands of companies worldwide use SolarWinds' Orion software to monitor their computer networks.
SolarWinds says that nearly 18,000 of its customers — in the government and the private sector — received the tainted software update from March to June of this year.
Here's what we know about the attack:
Who is responsible?
Russia's foreign intelligence service, the SVR, is believed to have carried out the hack, according to cybersecurity experts who cite the extremely sophisticated nature of the attack. Russia has denied involvement.
President Trump has been silent about the hack and his administration has not attributed blame. However, U.S. intelligence agencies have started briefing members of Congress, and several lawmakers have said the information they've seen points toward Russia.
Included are members of the Senate Armed Services Committee, where Chairman James Inhofe, a Republican from Oklahoma, and the top Democrat on the panel, Jack Reed of Rhode Island, issued a joint statement Thursday saying "the cyber intrusion appears to be ongoing and has the hallmarks of a Russian intelligence operation."
After several days of saying relatively little, the U.S. Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency on Thursday delivered an ominous warning, saying the hack "poses a grave risk" to federal, state and local governments as well as private companies and organizations.
In addition, CISA said that removing the malware will be "highly complex and challenging for organizations."
The episode is the latest in what has become a long list of suspected Russian electronic incursions into other nations under President Vladimir Putin. Multiple countries have previously accused Russia of using hackers, bots and other means in attempts to influence elections in the U.S. and elsewhere.
U.S. national security agencies made major efforts to prevent Russia from interfering in the 2020 election. But those same agencies seem to have been blindsided by the hackers who have had months to dig around inside U.S. government systems.
"It's as if you wake up one morning and suddenly realize that a burglar has been going in and out of your house for the last six months," said Glenn Gerstell, who was the National Security Agency's general counsel from 2015 to 2020.
Who was affected?
So far, the list of affected U.S. government entities reportedly includes the Commerce Department, the Department of Homeland Security, the Pentagon, the Treasury Department, the U.S. Postal Service and the National Institutes of Health.
The Department of Energy acknowledged its computer systems had been compromised, though it said malware was "isolated to business networks only, and has not impacted the mission essential national security functions of the Department, including the National Nuclear Security Administration."
SolarWinds has some 300,000 customers, but it said "fewer than 18,000" installed the version of its Orion products that appears to have been compromised.
The victims include government, consulting, technology, telecom and other entities in North America, Europe, Asia and the Middle East, according to the security firm FireEye, which helped raise the alarm about the breach.
After studying the malware, FireEye said it believes the breaches were carefully targeted: "These compromises are not self-propagating; each of the attacks require meticulous planning and manual interaction."
Microsoft, which is helping investigate the hack, says it identified 40 government agencies, companies and think tanks that have been infiltrated. While more than 30 victims are in the U.S., organizations were also hit in Canada, Mexico, Belgium, Spain, the United Kingdom, Israel and the United Arab Emirates.
"The attack unfortunately represents a broad and successful espionage-based assault on both the confidential information of the U.S. government and the tech tools used by firms to protect them," Microsoft's President Brad Smith wrote.
"While governments have spied on each other for centuries, the recent attackers used a technique that has put at risk the technology supply chain for the broader economy," he added.
How did the hack work?
Hackers exploited the way software companies distribute updates, adding malware to the legitimate package. Security analysts said the malicious code gave hackers a "backdoor" — a foothold in their targets' computer networks — which they then used to gain elevated credentials.
SolarWinds traced the "supply chain" attack to updates for its Orion network products between March and June.
"After an initial dormant period of up to two weeks, it retrieves and executes commands, called 'Jobs,' that include the ability to transfer files, execute files, profile the system, reboot the machine, and disable system services," FireEye said.
The malware was engineered to be stealthy, operating in ways that would masquerade as normal activity, FireEye said. It added that the malicious software could also identify forensic and anti-virus tools that might threaten it. And it said the credentials it used to move within the system were "always different from those used for remote access."
After gaining access, Microsoft said, the intruder also made changes to ensure long-term access, by adding new credentials and using administrator privileges to grant itself more permissions.
FireEye is calling the "Trojanized" SolarWinds software Sunburst. It named another piece of malware – which it said had never been seen before — TEARDROP.
What are investigators doing now?
SolarWinds said it is cooperating with the FBI, the U.S. intelligence community and other investigating agencies to learn more about the malware and its effects. The company and security firms also said any affected agencies or customers should update to the latest software to lessen their exposure to the vulnerability.
Microsoft has now taken control of the domain name that hackers used to communicate with systems that were compromised by the Orion update, according to security expert Brian Krebs. That access can help reveal the scope of the hack, he said.
What's next for the agencies and companies that were hacked?
Kevin Mandia, CEO of FireEye, told NPR that as companies and agencies learn they've been compromised, there's much to do: They must investigate the scale and scope of the attack, and eradicate the attackers from their network if they're still active. Even if they're not still active, he predicts months of remediation ahead.
For the U.S. government, Mandia says, there are bigger questions to be addressed — including a doctrine on what the U.S. expects nations' rules of engagement to be, and what the response will be to those who violate that doctrine.
This story was first published Dec. 15 and has been updated.


npr--2020-12-21--How A Cybersecurity Firm Uncovered The Massive Computer Hack

The first word that hackers had carried out a highly sophisticated intrusion into U.S. computer networks came on Dec. 8 , when the cybersecurity firm FireEye announced it had been breached and some of its most valuable tools had been stolen .
`` We escalated very quickly from the moment I got the first briefing that , 'Hey , we have a security incident of some magnitude , ' `` FireEye CEO Kevin Mandia told All Things Considered co-host Mary Louise Kelly .
`` My gut was telling me it was something we needed to put people on right away @ @ @ @ @ @ @ days , the scope of the hack began to emerge .
Multiple U.S. agencies were successfully targeted , including the departments of State , Treasury , Commerce , Energy and Homeland Security as well as the National Institutes of Health .
The hackers attached their malware to a software update from Austin , Texas-based company SolarWinds , which makes software used by many federal agencies and thousands of private companies to monitor their computer networks .
The SVR , Russia 's foreign intelligence agency , is considered the most likely culprit , according @ @ @ @ @ @ @ some members of Congress who have been briefed by the U.S. intelligence community .
But the Trump administration has not formally attributed blame .
`` What I 've seen is 2020 has been about the hardest year , period , to be an information security officer , '' Mandia said .
`` It 's time this nation comes up with some doctrine on what we expect nations ' rules of engagement to be , and what will our policy , or proportional response , be to folks who violate that doctrine .
Because @ @ @ @ @ @ @ in cyberspace . ''
Here are excerpts from Mandia 's interview : What was that moment like when you 're figuring out it 's your cybersecurity company that has been hacked ?
If you wrote down the reasons why another nation might want to compromise FireEye , you can come up with some reasons .
What we do is we track attackers and quite frankly , we out them .
We try to figure out — here 's their fingerprints , let 's share those fingerprints with everybody so they ca n't get @ @ @ @ @ @ @ [ Early on ] there was enough operational security by the attacker that I knew it was professional .
This was n't the first rodeo for these attackers .
In fact , they followed a tradecraft that the more I learned , the more this was a unit that 's been operational for a decade or more .
They knew what they were doing , they had novel techniques .
So we knew we would have to do the full-court press on our investigation .
And we did .
Who is behind this @ @ @ @ @ @ @ definitely a nation .
In regards to the supply chain compromise at SolarWinds , they did an innocuous addition of code in October 2019 inside the supply chain , saw that it was provisioned and deployed — so they knew that their techniques on offense to hack the supply chain were efficient and effective .
They went live with actual malicious code inside of the SolarWinds in March through June of this year .
So this is somebody who is patient , professional , and what made this interesting to me is I @ @ @ @ @ @ @ surreptitious and clandestine than they were about accomplishing their mission .
What nations have this kind of capability ?
Not a lot .
It 's very consistent with what Russia could do .
There might be a group out of China that might be able to do it .
And that 's probably it .
Is there any signature to this attack that would be consistent with other hacks you 've seen ?
There 's probably about six to eight technical details that made me realize this is a nation , and most @ @ @ @ @ @ @ breach .
One of them is this : They used an infrastructure to attack FireEye .
The IP addresses or systems they use to attack FireEye were not used in any other incident we 're aware of .
In other words , the attackers set up an infrastructure to attack FireEye that was wholly unique to attacking FireEye .
That takes a lot of maintenance .
That takes a lot of coordination .
That 's an operation — not just a hack .
Most threat groups , when they attack , will use @ @ @ @ @ @ @ This group does not do that .
That in and of itself made me realize it was an operation .
What should we take from the fact that it was FireEye , a private cybersecurity firm , that alerted the U.S. government — and not the other way around ?
We 're all in this together , period .
And there 's different visibility at different places .
When the attacks were happening against FireEye , all the IP addresses used to attack us [ were ] all inside the United States .
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ [ National Security Agency ] does not do collections within the United States .
So we were the ones , kind of on our own , to be able to see this and detect it .
So you 're saying you were able to see things that the NSA , despite all of its vast resources , have firewalls against being able to see , domestically ?
Well , I would n't call it firewalls necessarily .
It 's just legal remit .
You know , when you look at what these attackers @ @ @ @ @ @ @ from the United States .
That does n't necessarily mean the attackers are sitting in the United States — but the infrastructure they 're setting up to attack companies like FireEye are all in the United States .
So the malicious intent may not be visible outside the United States and may only be visible inside .
We have thousands and thousands of computers that we inspected for evidence that they were compromised , and we could n't get anything earlier in the time frame than a SolarWinds system .
We sat there @ @ @ @ @ @ @ `` We ca n't find anything bad on it right now , but it 's our earliest evidence of compromise .
Something 's wrong . ''
So we then had to turn it over to our reverse engineers .
This is something most companies ca n't do .
We went through 14 gig of information , over 18,000 files in the update that we got from SolarWinds , over 4,000 executable files .
We decompiled them into millions of lines .
And then with real malware analysts , we found the needle in @ @ @ @ @ @ @ the NSA itself was hacked ?
So what now ?
There 's a statement from the FBI and the director of national intelligence and the cybersecurity arm of Homeland Security that says this breach is ongoing .
I think as folks are being notified or learning that they 're compromised , they 're going to have a lot of work to do .
All these organizations are both going to have to investigate what happened and figure out the scale and scope of it , and then they 're going to have to @ @ @ @ @ @ @ they 're still active .
Even if they 're not active , you 're going to flex your muscle a little bit to do a lot of remediation .
That 's going to take months .
But one thing that 's definitely clear to me : The attackers have no idea what is the envelope of behavior , what are the rules of engagement .
We 're a nation losing billions of dollars to ransomware .
And we are a nation that just had potentially one of the most successful cyberespionage campaigns ever @ @ @ @

How A Cybersecurity Firm Uncovered The Massive Computer Hack
Enlarge this image toggle caption Susan Walsh/AP Susan Walsh/AP
The first word that hackers had carried out a highly sophisticated intrusion into U.S. computer networks came on Dec. 8, when the cybersecurity firm FireEye announced it had been breached and some of its most valuable tools had been stolen.
"We escalated very quickly from the moment I got the first briefing that, 'Hey, we have a security incident of some magnitude,' " FireEye CEO Kevin Mandia told All Things Considered co-host Mary Louise Kelly. "My gut was telling me it was something we needed to put people on right away."
Mandia was right. Within days, the scope of the hack began to emerge.
Multiple U.S. agencies were successfully targeted, including the departments of State, Treasury, Commerce, Energy and Homeland Security as well as the National Institutes of Health.
The hackers attached their malware to a software update from Austin, Texas-based company SolarWinds, which makes software used by many federal agencies and thousands of private companies to monitor their computer networks.
The SVR, Russia's foreign intelligence agency, is considered the most likely culprit, according to Secretary of State Mike Pompeo and some members of Congress who have been briefed by the U.S. intelligence community. But the Trump administration has not formally attributed blame.
"What I've seen is 2020 has been about the hardest year, period, to be an information security officer," Mandia said. "It's time this nation comes up with some doctrine on what we expect nations' rules of engagement to be, and what will our policy, or proportional response, be to folks who violate that doctrine. Because right now there's absolutely an escalation in cyberspace."
Here are excerpts from Mandia's interview:
What was that moment like when you're figuring out it's your cybersecurity company that has been hacked?
If you wrote down the reasons why another nation might want to compromise FireEye, you can come up with some reasons. What we do is we track attackers and quite frankly, we out them. We try to figure out — here's their fingerprints, let's share those fingerprints with everybody so they can't get away with what they're doing.
[Early on] there was enough operational security by the attacker that I knew it was professional. This wasn't the first rodeo for these attackers. In fact, they followed a tradecraft that the more I learned, the more this was a unit that's been operational for a decade or more. They knew what they were doing, they had novel techniques. So we knew we would have to do the full-court press on our investigation. And we did.
Who is behind this attack?
For me, it's definitely a nation. In regards to the supply chain compromise at SolarWinds, they did an innocuous addition of code in October 2019 inside the supply chain, saw that it was provisioned and deployed — so they knew that their techniques on offense to hack the supply chain were efficient and effective. They went live with actual malicious code inside of the SolarWinds in March through June of this year.
So this is somebody who is patient, professional, and what made this interesting to me is I felt they were more interested in staying surreptitious and clandestine than they were about accomplishing their mission.
What nations have this kind of capability?
Not a lot. It's very consistent with what Russia could do. There might be a group out of China that might be able to do it. And that's probably it.
Is there any signature to this attack that would be consistent with other hacks you've seen?
There's probably about six to eight technical details that made me realize this is a nation, and most likely a foreign intelligence service doing this breach. One of them is this: They used an infrastructure to attack FireEye. The IP addresses or systems they use to attack FireEye were not used in any other incident we're aware of.
In other words, the attackers set up an infrastructure to attack FireEye that was wholly unique to attacking FireEye. That takes a lot of maintenance. That takes a lot of coordination. That's an operation — not just a hack. Most threat groups, when they attack, will use shared infrastructure to attack many companies. This group does not do that. That in and of itself made me realize it was an operation.
What should we take from the fact that it was FireEye, a private cybersecurity firm, that alerted the U.S. government — and not the other way around?
We're all in this together, period. And there's different visibility at different places. When the attacks were happening against FireEye, all the IP addresses used to attack us [were] all inside the United States. And I'm pretty aware that the [National Security Agency] does not do collections within the United States. So we were the ones, kind of on our own, to be able to see this and detect it.
So you're saying you were able to see things that the NSA, despite all of its vast resources, have firewalls against being able to see, domestically?
Well, I wouldn't call it firewalls necessarily. It's just legal remit. You know, when you look at what these attackers do, they're attacking U.S. companies from the United States. That doesn't necessarily mean the attackers are sitting in the United States — but the infrastructure they're setting up to attack companies like FireEye are all in the United States. So the malicious intent may not be visible outside the United States and may only be visible inside.
We have thousands and thousands of computers that we inspected for evidence that they were compromised, and we couldn't get anything earlier in the time frame than a SolarWinds system. We sat there looking at the SolarWinds system saying, "We can't find anything bad on it right now, but it's our earliest evidence of compromise. Something's wrong."
So we then had to turn it over to our reverse engineers. This is something most companies can't do. We went through 14 gig of information, over 18,000 files in the update that we got from SolarWinds, over 4,000 executable files. We decompiled them into millions of lines. And then with real malware analysts, we found the needle in the haystack.
Do we know whether the NSA itself was hacked?
I don't have any idea.
So what now? There's a statement from the FBI and the director of national intelligence and the cybersecurity arm of Homeland Security that says this breach is ongoing.
I think as folks are being notified or learning that they're compromised, they're going to have a lot of work to do. All these organizations are both going to have to investigate what happened and figure out the scale and scope of it, and then they're going to have to eradicate the attackers from their network if they're still active.
Even if they're not active, you're going to flex your muscle a little bit to do a lot of remediation. That's going to take months.
But one thing that's definitely clear to me: The attackers have no idea what is the envelope of behavior, what are the rules of engagement.
We're a nation losing billions of dollars to ransomware. And we are a nation that just had potentially one of the most successful cyberespionage campaigns ever done on it.


npr--2020-12-21--$4 In My Bank Account: Pandemic Has Left Millions Of Livelihoods In Limbo

$ 4 In My Bank Account : Pandemic Has Left Millions Of Livelihoods In Limbo By the end of last year , the door to a dream had begun to crack open for Lilli Rayne .
She 'd spent about five years building her dog-walking and pet-sitting business into a profitable venture in Asheville , N.C. '' My whole life had been entirely where I wanted it to be at that point , '' she recalls .
As she built her business , Rayne also left behind her history of less-than-stellar credit .
`` For the first time in my @ @ @ @ @ @ @ that I could have finally bought a home with , '' she says , a dream she 'd had her entire adult life .
Rayne is in her late 30s , and in a good week , she was bringing in about $ 600 .
She had some savings and enough for a house payment .
Then , coronavirus .
Between the drop in people traveling and the fact that so many are working from home , the demand for dog walkers is nearly nonexistent , Rayne says .
Nine months into the @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
Instead of looking forward to buying a house , she 's now dodging calls from bill collectors .
Rayne 's story is playing out across the U.S. in the pandemic-induced downturn that has walloped working-class people .
More than 10 million people are out of jobs , and some of the hardest-hit industries are also among the lowest paying , including retail , leisure , hospitality and tourism .
`` A lot of these jobs [ are ] working-class , blue-collar jobs .
And the loss of these types of jobs has @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , an economics professor at John Jay College of Criminal Justice at the City University of New York .
There are the lost wages .
But losses beget further losses and the devastation compounds , Holder explains .
`` For people who lose their jobs , they are at risk of losing their homes .
They 're at risk for food insecurity , '' she says .
`` If they have children , their children are at risk for the same things . ''
More than 50 million people in the U.S. will @ @ @ @ @ @ @ of 2020 , an increase of more than 13 million from 2018 , according to Feeding America , a national network of 200 food banks .
Rayne has woven together a safety net since her business fell apart .
She receives $ 192 a month in SNAP benefits to buy groceries .
She also relies on the $ 500 in Social Security survivor benefits she began to receive after her father 's death before the pandemic .
Her mom pays her phone bill .
`` I do n't like relying on my mother @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , '' Rayne says .
`` I 'm an adult .
Thirty-nine years old .
I should be able to pay my phone bill . ''
But Rayne says that her safety net is fraying .
She has maxed out several credit cards and has started to take out payday loans to cover bills .
She fears some of the holes in her safety net have grown big enough to fall through .
`` My bank account has $ 4 in it right now , '' Rayne says .
`` I would love @ @ @ @ @ @ @ not to give us more stimulus money to see what it 's really like to live like this . ''
Early in the pandemic , the federal government stepped in with a menu of aid programs , including an extra $ 600 per week of unemployment benefits , benefits for self-employed people who had lost work and one-time relief checks of up to $ 1,200 for individuals .
`` The [ government ] stepped up and stepped in to assist people in America in getting through , '' says Holder .
`` I @ @ @ @ @ @ @ [ were ] really working at that juncture , but as time wore on and the pandemic wore on , that was not sustained . ''
Nearly 8 million people have fallen into poverty since the middle of the year , according to new data from researchers at the University of Chicago and the University of Notre Dame .
The researchers attribute that sharp increase to the expiration of federal aid programs created to help those in need .
Congress now appears to be on the cusp of passing a $ 900 billion @ @ @ @ @ @ @ have lost their jobs , a $ 600 check for individuals making less than $ 75,000 a year and aid for small businesses .
But the help would come after many months of inaction — months that were punctuated by mass layoffs and businesses going belly up .
In March , the last time Congress came together to pass a major package of pandemic support , airlines were thrown a $ 58 billion lifeline .
That support likely helped keep people like Delta Air Lines customer service representative Jasmine Doakes in Cincinnati on @ @ @ @ @ @ @ excited about this year , working and just growing , '' she recalls .
`` All these plans of getting to my 10th year at Delta . ''
But the infusion of federal money went only so far , while air travel plummeted .
In August , Doakes , 33 , was laid off .
She joined millions of other people looking for work .
But Doakes also has health problems — she has lupus , an autoimmune disease — that have hindered her job search .
`` So it really has been @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Doakes considers herself a positive person but admits that she 's struggling right now .
On top of losing her job and the challenges of lupus , she also has COVID-19 now .
`` I 'm grateful because I 'm still alive , '' she says .
These days , most people do recover from the disease .
And the first round of COVID-19 vaccinations is being administered .
But in a news conference last week , Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell reminded Congress that the pandemic is far from over .
`` @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , '' he said .
`` Now that we can see the light at the end of the tunnel , it would be bad to see people losing their business — their life 's work in many cases or even generations ' worth of work — because they could n't last another few months . ''
Nevertheless , Powell said , the vaccine is cause for cautious optimism : `` Sometime in the middle of next year , you will see people feeling comfortable going out and engaging in a broader range of @ @ @ @ @ @ @ downturn has been uneven — disproportionately affecting working-class and lower-income people — there is reason to believe the recovery will be uneven as well , according to Holder , the economist .
For instance , she notes that men , and especially men of color , make up a large share of cab drivers and public transit workers .
`` But this pandemic has shown us that we can work from home , '' she says .
`` And people will not necessarily need to move around outside as much as they used @ @ @ @ @ @ @ direct implications for men of color who are overrepresented in the transportation sector . ''
`` I do think that there are going to be some jobs that just will not return , '' Holder says .
Rayne , the dog walker and pet sitter in North Carolina , hopes that is n't the case for her .
`` For the first time in my life , I was running my own business .
And I was not only running my own business — I was really good at it , '' she @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
It 's fun .
It 's casual .
But to me , it 's my career . ''
For now , her career and livelihood are on hold until the pandemic lets up and the U.S. can let its collective guard down .

'My Bank Account Has $4': Pandemic Has Left Millions Of Livelihoods In Limbo
Enlarge this image toggle caption Sarah Gonzales for NPR Sarah Gonzales for NPR
By the end of last year, the door to a dream had begun to crack open for Lilli Rayne.
She'd spent about five years building her dog-walking and pet-sitting business into a profitable venture in Asheville, N.C.
"My whole life had been entirely where I wanted it to be at that point," she recalls.
As she built her business, Rayne also left behind her history of less-than-stellar credit.
"For the first time in my life, I had a credit score that I could have finally bought a home with," she says, a dream she'd had her entire adult life.
Rayne is in her late 30s, and in a good week, she was bringing in about $600. She had some savings and enough for a house payment.
Then, coronavirus. Between the drop in people traveling and the fact that so many are working from home, the demand for dog walkers is nearly nonexistent, Rayne says.
Nine months into the pandemic, her business has basically evaporated. Instead of looking forward to buying a house, she's now dodging calls from bill collectors.
Rayne's story is playing out across the U.S. in the pandemic-induced downturn that has walloped working-class people. More than 10 million people are out of jobs, and some of the hardest-hit industries are also among the lowest paying, including retail, leisure, hospitality and tourism.
Enlarge this image toggle caption Lilli Rayne Lilli Rayne
"A lot of these jobs [are] working-class, blue-collar jobs. And the loss of these types of jobs has been devastating," says Michelle Holder, an economics professor at John Jay College of Criminal Justice at the City University of New York.
There are the lost wages. But losses beget further losses and the devastation compounds, Holder explains.
"For people who lose their jobs, they are at risk of losing their homes. They're at risk for food insecurity," she says. "If they have children, their children are at risk for the same things."
More than 50 million people in the U.S. will have experienced food insecurity by the end of 2020, an increase of more than 13 million from 2018, according to Feeding America, a national network of 200 food banks.
Rayne has woven together a safety net since her business fell apart. She receives $192 a month in SNAP benefits to buy groceries. She also relies on the $500 in Social Security survivor benefits she began to receive after her father's death before the pandemic. Her mom pays her phone bill.
"I don't like relying on my mother. She makes very limited income herself," Rayne says. "I'm an adult. Thirty-nine years old. I should be able to pay my phone bill."
But Rayne says that her safety net is fraying. She has maxed out several credit cards and has started to take out payday loans to cover bills. She fears some of the holes in her safety net have grown big enough to fall through.
"My bank account has $4 in it right now," Rayne says. "I would love the people in Washington who have decided not to give us more stimulus money to see what it's really like to live like this."
Early in the pandemic, the federal government stepped in with a menu of aid programs, including an extra $600 per week of unemployment benefits, benefits for self-employed people who had lost work and one-time relief checks of up to $1,200 for individuals.
"The [government] stepped up and stepped in to assist people in America in getting through," says Holder. "I think that fiscal policy and public policy [were] really working at that juncture, but as time wore on and the pandemic wore on, that was not sustained."
Nearly 8 million people have fallen into poverty since the middle of the year, according to new data from researchers at the University of Chicago and the University of Notre Dame. The researchers attribute that sharp increase to the expiration of federal aid programs created to help those in need.
Congress now appears to be on the cusp of passing a $900 billion relief package with help for people who have lost their jobs, a $600 check for individuals making less than $75,000 a year and aid for small businesses. But the help would come after many months of inaction — months that were punctuated by mass layoffs and businesses going belly up.
In March, the last time Congress came together to pass a major package of pandemic support, airlines were thrown a $58 billion lifeline.
That support likely helped keep people like Delta Air Lines customer service representative Jasmine Doakes in Cincinnati on the payroll.
"I was so excited about this year, working and just growing," she recalls. "All these plans of getting to my 10th year at Delta."
But the infusion of federal money went only so far, while air travel plummeted. In August, Doakes, 33, took a separation package from the company.
She then joined millions of other people looking for work. But Doakes also has health problems — she has lupus, an autoimmune disease — that have hindered her job search.
"So it really has been a challenge," she says.
Doakes considers herself a positive person but admits that she's struggling right now. On top of leaving her job and the challenges of lupus, she also has COVID-19 now.
"I'm grateful because I'm still alive," she says.
These days, most people do recover from the disease. And the first round of COVID-19 vaccinations is being administered.
But in a news conference last week, Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell reminded Congress that the pandemic is far from over.
"We know there's need out there," he said. "Now that we can see the light at the end of the tunnel, it would be bad to see people losing their business — their life's work in many cases or even generations' worth of work — because they couldn't last another few months."
Nevertheless, Powell said, the vaccine is cause for cautious optimism: "Sometime in the middle of next year, you will see people feeling comfortable going out and engaging in a broader range of activities."
But given that the downturn has been uneven — disproportionately affecting working-class and lower-income people — there is reason to believe the recovery will be uneven as well, according to Holder, the economist.
For instance, she notes that men, and especially men of color, make up a large share of cab drivers and public transit workers.
"But this pandemic has shown us that we can work from home," she says. "And people will not necessarily need to move around outside as much as they used to. That's going to have direct implications for men of color who are overrepresented in the transportation sector."
"I do think that there are going to be some jobs that just will not return," Holder says.
Rayne, the dog walker and pet sitter in North Carolina, hopes that isn't the case for her.
"For the first time in my life, I was running my own business. And I was not only running my own business — I was really good at it," she says. "It's pet sitting. It's fun. It's casual. But to me, it's my career."
For now, her career and livelihood are on hold until the pandemic lets up and the U.S. can let its collective guard down.


npr--2020-12-21--Putin And Biden Signal Chilly Relations To Come

Putin And Biden Signal Chilly Relations To Come As the news broke in November that Joe Biden had won enough states to be declared president-elect , congratulations poured in from world leaders .
Russian President Vladimir Putin was conspicuously absent from the list of well-wishers — and waited for more than a month , until the Electoral College vote last week , before congratulating him .
`` It 's classic Putin , '' says Konstantin Eggert , a Russian political commentator .
`` By not congratulating Biden for so long , he — in his eyes at least — proved @ @ @ @ @ @ @ strong , and , if need be , he 's ready to take the fight all the way to Washington . ''
The two leaders have a history going back to when Biden was President Barack Obama 's vice president .
According to Biden , he once told Putin he had looked into his eyes and did n't think Putin had a soul .
During the presidential election campaign , Biden called Russia `` the biggest threat to America . ''
After a massive hack of U.S. government agencies was blamed on Russia @ @ @ @ @ @ @ would be costs for the perpetrators .
Still , that adversarial relationship does n't mean that Putin is unwilling to speak to Biden , Eggert says .
`` For Putin , the priority always was to be seen as talking to the United States .
And interestingly enough , in a very large measure , the Trump administration denied him this possibility , '' Eggert says .
`` For him , being able to speak one-on-one with the United States is proof of Russia 's superpower status and his global role . ''
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ that it was time to `` press the reset button '' in relations with Russia .
The Obama administration placed its bets on Dmitry Medvedev , whom Putin had installed as his successor after two terms as president .
Medvedev was younger and more Western-oriented than his mentor , and Biden said on a visit to Moscow that if Putin — then prime minister — ran for a third presidential term , it would be bad for Russia .
Putin ignored Biden 's admonitions and returned to the presidency .
After Russia invaded @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Obama administration 's point man on rallying European allies in support of Kyiv — and against Moscow .
Biden knows the former Soviet Union , having made his first trip to Moscow in 1973 .
Compared with the last three U.S. presidents , he will also take office with hands-on experience in dealing with Putin .
`` They certainly know each other , but I think it 's a fairly realistic but probably brittle relationship , '' says Angela Stent , a professor at Georgetown University .
`` I do n't think you @ @ @ @ @ @ @ '' Russia 's ruling class views the Biden administration as a mere continuation of the Obama presidency , says Moscow political analyst Stanislav Belkovsky .
Putin will likely place little value on his personal rapport with Biden , according to Belkovsky .
He says Putin learned his lesson after his good personal relationship with President Trump failed to prevent their countries ' ties from sinking to the lowest point since the Cold War .
`` Putin has come to the conclusion that personal relations do n't add anything to the relationship .
Even @ @ @ @ @ @ @ bad , nothing would change either way , '' Belkovsky says .
`` Putin does n't count on personal relations with American leaders .
Today he only counts on the intersection of interests in certain areas . ''
One of those areas is arms control .
The New START treaty , the last agreement limiting U.S. and Russian nuclear weapons , expires just 16 days after Biden 's inauguration .
`` I think the No .
1 priority has to be the extension of New START , '' Stent says .
Other priorities @ @ @ @ @ @ @ will be climate change and the future of economic sanctions against Russia that began under the Obama administration and only tightened under Trump .
`` Another priority clearly for the Biden administration will be democracy promotion , human rights and global kleptocracy , '' Stent says .
`` And these are issues where the relationship with Russia could well deteriorate . ''
The Kremlin expects Biden — and Democratic administrations in general — to address human rights , Eggert says .
`` The Kremlin looks at actions rather than words , '' he @ @ @ @ @ @ @ if Biden took such steps as inviting Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny to the White House or actively supporting the pro-democracy movement in Belarus , Eggert says .
How U.S. foreign policy is implemented will likely fall to Antony Blinken , Obama 's deputy secretary of state and deputy national security adviser , whom Biden has nominated as his secretary of state .
Stent says Blinken , who has worked closely with Biden , would bring back a sense of normalcy both within the U.S. administration and in its day-to-day dealings with Moscow @ @ @ @ @ @ @ a desire to , first of all , have a more coherent policy toward Russia — unlike the Trump administration , where the president himself had his own policy of trying to improve ties and the rest of the executive branch were much tougher , '' she says .
Diplomatic channels that `` atrophied '' in the Trump State Department are likely to be reestablished , Stent says .
In Moscow , Blinken is not expected to revive the close working relationship that Obama 's second secretary of state , John Kerry , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
Eggert says that while the Kremlin viewed Kerry as weak and naive , Blinken is preceded by a much tougher reputation in Russia .
`` Maybe he will be quite an unpleasant interlocutor for Lavrov , which may not be bad because the Russian political class only respects force and strength , '' Eggert says .
But if Blinken represents Biden 's strength toward Russia , the president-elect 's son Hunter could become a liability .
Hunter Biden is currently under a federal tax investigation .
He also sat on the board @ @ @ @ @ @ @ father was responsible for Ukraine as vice president .
`` Putin will use his online trolls and disinformation to use this story to weaken Biden , '' Eggert says .
`` But on the other hand , if he feels that the current administration is prepared to talk to him , I think he will not overstep a certain limit . ''
For now , Putin is watching and waiting as the new administration prepares to take office .
His public remarks about Biden have been restrained , just like his congratulations to @ @ @ @ @ @ @ is a certain amount of glee in the Kremlin about the results of the U.S. presidential election , Belkovsky says .
`` Putin is very happy about the chaos in the U.S. political system and in tallying up the votes .
The Kremlin believes that America no longer has the moral right to criticize Russia 's electoral system , '' he says .
What 's important for Putin , Belkovsky says , is that political theater in the United States has discredited American democracy in the eyes of the world .

Putin And Biden Signal Chilly Relations To Come
Enlarge this image toggle caption Ivan Sekretarev/AP Ivan Sekretarev/AP
As the news broke in November that Joe Biden had won enough states to be declared president-elect, congratulations poured in from world leaders. Russian President Vladimir Putin was conspicuously absent from the list of well-wishers — and waited for more than a month, until the Electoral College vote last week, before congratulating him.
"It's classic Putin," says Konstantin Eggert, a Russian political commentator. "By not congratulating Biden for so long, he — in his eyes at least — proved that he's tough, he's strong, and, if need be, he's ready to take the fight all the way to Washington."
The two leaders have a history going back to when Biden was President Barack Obama's vice president. According to Biden, he once told Putin he had looked into his eyes and didn't think Putin had a soul. During the presidential election campaign, Biden called Russia "the biggest threat to America." After a massive hack of U.S. government agencies was blamed on Russia this month, the president-elect said there would be costs for the perpetrators.
Still, that adversarial relationship doesn't mean that Putin is unwilling to speak to Biden, Eggert says.
"For Putin, the priority always was to be seen as talking to the United States. And interestingly enough, in a very large measure, the Trump administration denied him this possibility," Eggert says. "For him, being able to speak one-on-one with the United States is proof of Russia's superpower status and his global role."
It was Biden who announced in 2009 that it was time to "press the reset button" in relations with Russia. The Obama administration placed its bets on Dmitry Medvedev, whom Putin had installed as his successor after two terms as president. Medvedev was younger and more Western-oriented than his mentor, and Biden said on a visit to Moscow that if Putin — then prime minister — ran for a third presidential term, it would be bad for Russia. Putin ignored Biden's admonitions and returned to the presidency. After Russia invaded Ukraine in 2014, Biden became the Obama administration's point man on rallying European allies in support of Kyiv — and against Moscow.
Enlarge this image toggle caption Alexander Zemlianichenko/AP Alexander Zemlianichenko/AP
Biden knows the former Soviet Union, having made his first trip to Moscow in 1973. Compared with the last three U.S. presidents, he will also take office with hands-on experience in dealing with Putin.
"They certainly know each other, but I think it's a fairly realistic but probably brittle relationship," says Angela Stent, a professor at Georgetown University. "I don't think you'd expect any breakthrough anytime soon."
Russia's ruling class views the Biden administration as a mere continuation of the Obama presidency, says Moscow political analyst Stanislav Belkovsky.
Putin will likely place little value on his personal rapport with Biden, according to Belkovsky. He says Putin learned his lesson after his good personal relationship with President Trump failed to prevent their countries' ties from sinking to the lowest point since the Cold War.
"Putin has come to the conclusion that personal relations don't add anything to the relationship. Even if they were really good or really bad, nothing would change either way," Belkovsky says. "Putin doesn't count on personal relations with American leaders. Today he only counts on the intersection of interests in certain areas."
One of those areas is arms control. The New START treaty, the last agreement limiting U.S. and Russian nuclear weapons, expires just 16 days after Biden's inauguration.
"I think the No. 1 priority has to be the extension of New START," Stent says. Other priorities in the relationship, she says, will be climate change and the future of economic sanctions against Russia that began under the Obama administration and only tightened under Trump.
"Another priority clearly for the Biden administration will be democracy promotion, human rights and global kleptocracy," Stent says. "And these are issues where the relationship with Russia could well deteriorate."
The Kremlin expects Biden — and Democratic administrations in general — to address human rights, Eggert says.
"The Kremlin looks at actions rather than words," he says. Putin would start getting concerned if Biden took such steps as inviting Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny to the White House or actively supporting the pro-democracy movement in Belarus, Eggert says.
Enlarge this image toggle caption Carolyn Kaster/AP Carolyn Kaster/AP
How U.S. foreign policy is implemented will likely fall to Antony Blinken, Obama's deputy secretary of state and deputy national security adviser, whom Biden has nominated as his secretary of state.
Stent says Blinken, who has worked closely with Biden, would bring back a sense of normalcy both within the U.S. administration and in its day-to-day dealings with Moscow.
"I think one could see a desire to, first of all, have a more coherent policy toward Russia — unlike the Trump administration, where the president himself had his own policy of trying to improve ties and the rest of the executive branch were much tougher," she says. Diplomatic channels that "atrophied" in the Trump State Department are likely to be reestablished, Stent says.
In Moscow, Blinken is not expected to revive the close working relationship that Obama's second secretary of state, John Kerry, developed with Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov.
Eggert says that while the Kremlin viewed Kerry as weak and naive, Blinken is preceded by a much tougher reputation in Russia.
"Maybe he will be quite an unpleasant interlocutor for Lavrov, which may not be bad because the Russian political class only respects force and strength," Eggert says.
But if Blinken represents Biden's strength toward Russia, the president-elect's son Hunter could become a liability.
Hunter Biden is currently under a federal tax investigation. He also sat on the board of a Ukrainian energy company while his father was responsible for Ukraine as vice president.
"Putin will use his online trolls and disinformation to use this story to weaken Biden," Eggert says. "But on the other hand, if he feels that the current administration is prepared to talk to him, I think he will not overstep a certain limit."
For now, Putin is watching and waiting as the new administration prepares to take office. His public remarks about Biden have been restrained, just like his congratulations to the president-elect.
In fact, there is a certain amount of glee in the Kremlin about the results of the U.S. presidential election, Belkovsky says.
"Putin is very happy about the chaos in the U.S. political system and in tallying up the votes. The Kremlin believes that America no longer has the moral right to criticize Russia's electoral system," he says.
What's important for Putin, Belkovsky says, is that political theater in the United States has discredited American democracy in the eyes of the world.


npr--2020-12-21--Former Government Cybersecurity Head Blames Russian Intelligence For Massive Hack

Christopher Krebs , the former top cybersecurity official in the U.S. , says Russia is to blame for a massive breach that 's affected the State Department , the Pentagon , the Treasury Department , the Department of Homeland Security and other departments and agencies .
`` I understand it is , in fact , the Russians , '' Krebs told Steve Inskeep on Morning Edition .
`` It 's the Russian SVR , which is their foreign intelligence service .
They are really the best of the best out there .
They 're a top flight cyber intelligence team @ @ @ @ @ @ @ techniques to really find the seams in our cyberdefenses here in the United States and seem to be quite successful in penetrating some very sensitive places . ''
Determining blame for cyberattacks is complex .
The agency Krebs led until November , the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency , described the hackers as `` patient , well-resourced , and focused , '' but did not blame any one entity .
But Krebs joins Secretary of State Mike Pompeo , Attorney General William Barr , and lawmakers including Sens .
Jim Inhofe , R-Okla. @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Mitt Romney , R-Utah , in pointing toward Russia as the culprit .
President Trump has instead suggested China could be behind the hack .
Trump fired Krebs in November after Krebs said the November election was secure and free of interference .
Krebs talked with NPR about how the hack happened , if it 's an `` attack '' or `` espionage , '' and how the U.S. should respond .
Here are excerpts : When I think about Internet security as a layman , I 'm aware that one of the @ @ @ @ @ @ @ be ... that I 'm offered some update that 's not an update or asked to click on a link that 's not really what it purports to be .
Does it surprise you that the government was caught in this rather straightforward way ?
I actually would maybe characterize it a little bit differently in that the majority of attacks these days or cyber compromises are getting someone to click on a link via an email or open an attachment .
And that 's really attempting to come in through the front @ @ @ @ @ @ @ different in that it is a supply chain compromise and they 're exploiting trusted relationships between the government in this case and a third party .
So they go one step out to come in the back door .
...
It is exploiting a trusted relationship with a third party .
Software in particular is one of those things where you assume that when it comes to you and it 's signed , you know , the certificate of authenticity that comes along with the software update when it says it 's good @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
The Government Accountability Office raised this supply chain concern a couple of years ago .
Did you discuss it at your agency when you were in the government ?
Supply chain security was a priority of ours at CISA .
And in fact , in 2018 , we established a supply chain risk management task force to share best practices and the things that were working .
But unfortunately , even if you know the right things to do , it takes commitment from executives , from leadership , it takes investment @ @ @ @ @ @ @ if not years to get into a really secure posture .
Did the pandemic make it harder to detect ?
Because people were distracted , people were scattered , people were working from home .
I think in March when COVID hit and everybody scattered to the four corners and were working from home , that introduced a number of additional vulnerabilities .
Or another way to put it is it really expanded the potential attack surface for an adversary .
So I suspect that it was n't the principal cause of this @ @ @ @ @ @ @ earlier detection earlier in the year .
What is a proper strategic response to this kind of attack ?
I think we have to be very careful about this point because this is an espionage operation .
...
If I was national security adviser for the day , I think I would make a very strong statement to the Kremlin to say , `` We know you 're responsible for this .
And if you do anything destructive or damaging with the access that you may still have , that will be deemed @ @ @ @ @ @ @ set of capabilities that the U.S. government could bring . ''
And in the meantime , you have to keep working through your instant response plan .
You have to keep working through the detection activities to find the adversary and kick them out .
Are Russia 's systems as vulnerable as the United States ' systems seem to be ?
In the U.S. , we are one of the most modern economies in the world .
And unfortunately , a lot of that modernization is dependent upon IT infrastructure and communications infrastructure @ @ @ @ @ @ @ `` glass houses '' here .
As for Russia , they are not as dependent upon the global economy as we are .
So to a certain extent , geopolitically , they have some advantages , but also the fact that their cyber capabilities is one of the few things that does keep them relevant geopolitically .
When you were in government , how hard did the president make it to focus on the very real threat of Russia ?
For our team at CISA , we had all the operational authority we @ @ @ @ @ @ @ on the various cybersecurity initiatives that we had , irrespective of the adversary , Russia , China and really increasingly , cyber criminals .
So I feel like for domestic purposes , we had the room to operate we needed .
We did not have , though , some of the authorities we needed or the budget that we needed .
And that has been something that we 've worked closely with the Congress on .
And this year 's National Defense Authorization Act is probably the biggest cybersecurity legislation package in recent @ @ @ @ @ @ @ unfortunately sitting , languishing , on the Resolute Desk in the Oval Office .
And that bill needs to be signed immediately .
Ryan Benk and Kelley Dickens produced and edited the audio interview .

Former Government Cybersecurity Head Blames Russian Intelligence For Massive Hack
Enlarge this image toggle caption Greg Nash/Pool/Getty Images Greg Nash/Pool/Getty Images
Christopher Krebs, the former top cybersecurity official in the U.S., says Russia is to blame for a massive breach that's affected the State Department, the Pentagon, the Treasury Department, the Department of Homeland Security and other departments and agencies.
"I understand it is, in fact, the Russians," Krebs told Steve Inskeep on Morning Edition.
"It's the Russian SVR, which is their foreign intelligence service. They are really the best of the best out there. They're a top flight cyber intelligence team, and they used some very sophisticated techniques to really find the seams in our cyberdefenses here in the United States and seem to be quite successful in penetrating some very sensitive places."
Determining blame for cyberattacks is complex. The agency Krebs led until November, the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency, described the hackers as "patient, well-resourced, and focused," but did not blame any one entity.
But Krebs joins Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, Attorney General William Barr, and lawmakers including Sens. Jim Inhofe, R-Okla., Jack Reed, D-R.I., and Mitt Romney, R-Utah, in pointing toward Russia as the culprit.
President Trump has instead suggested China could be behind the hack.
Trump fired Krebs in November after Krebs said the November election was secure and free of interference.
Krebs talked with NPR about how the hack happened, if it's an "attack" or "espionage," and how the U.S. should respond. Here are excerpts:
When I think about Internet security as a layman, I'm aware that one of the easiest ways to get at me would be ... that I'm offered some update that's not an update or asked to click on a link that's not really what it purports to be. Does it surprise you that the government was caught in this rather straightforward way?
I actually would maybe characterize it a little bit differently in that the majority of attacks these days or cyber compromises are getting someone to click on a link via an email or open an attachment. And that's really attempting to come in through the front door.
This is a little bit different in that it is a supply chain compromise and they're exploiting trusted relationships between the government in this case and a third party. So they go one step out to come in the back door. ...
It is exploiting a trusted relationship with a third party. Software in particular is one of those things where you assume that when it comes to you and it's signed, you know, the certificate of authenticity that comes along with the software update when it says it's good, you expect it to be good.
The Government Accountability Office raised this supply chain concern a couple of years ago. Did you discuss it at your agency when you were in the government?
Supply chain security was a priority of ours at CISA. And in fact, in 2018, we established a supply chain risk management task force to share best practices and the things that were working. But unfortunately, even if you know the right things to do, it takes commitment from executives, from leadership, it takes investment. So it can take months, if not years to get into a really secure posture.
Did the pandemic make it harder to detect? Because people were distracted, people were scattered, people were working from home.
I think in March when COVID hit and everybody scattered to the four corners and were working from home, that introduced a number of additional vulnerabilities. Or another way to put it is it really expanded the potential attack surface for an adversary.
So I suspect that it wasn't the principal cause of this, but it may have complicated the earlier detection earlier in the year.
What is a proper strategic response to this kind of attack?
I think we have to be very careful about this point because this is an espionage operation. ... If I was national security adviser for the day, I think I would make a very strong statement to the Kremlin to say, "We know you're responsible for this. And if you do anything destructive or damaging with the access that you may still have, that will be deemed as escalatory, and there are a set of capabilities that the U.S. government could bring."
And in the meantime, you have to keep working through your instant response plan. You have to keep working through the detection activities to find the adversary and kick them out.
Are Russia's systems as vulnerable as the United States' systems seem to be?
In the U.S., we are one of the most modern economies in the world. And unfortunately, a lot of that modernization is dependent upon IT infrastructure and communications infrastructure. So there is an element of "glass houses" here. As for Russia, they are not as dependent upon the global economy as we are. So to a certain extent, geopolitically, they have some advantages, but also the fact that their cyber capabilities is one of the few things that does keep them relevant geopolitically.
When you were in government, how hard did the president make it to focus on the very real threat of Russia?
For our team at CISA, we had all the operational authority we needed to protect elections, to work on the various cybersecurity initiatives that we had, irrespective of the adversary, Russia, China and really increasingly, cyber criminals. So I feel like for domestic purposes, we had the room to operate we needed.
We did not have, though, some of the authorities we needed or the budget that we needed. And that has been something that we've worked closely with the Congress on. And this year's National Defense Authorization Act is probably the biggest cybersecurity legislation package in recent years. And it right now is unfortunately sitting, languishing, on the Resolute Desk in the Oval Office. And that bill needs to be signed immediately.
Ryan Benk and Kelley Dickens produced and edited the audio interview.