npr--2020-03-08--International Women's Day: With Shoes And Stones, Islamists Disrupt Pakistan Rally

Demonstrators belonging to Islamist groups attacked an International Women 's Day rally in the Pakistani capital Islamabad on Sunday , hurling rocks , chunks of mud and even their shoes .
The demonstrators , who were at a rival rally held by hardline Islamist organizations , were particularly enraged by one slogan the women 's day rally adopted : `` mera jism , mera marzi '' – `` my body , my choice . ''
Riot police set up large cloth barricades to dive the rival rallies , which flanked either side of a main road .
But the police @ @ @ @ @ @ @ 's day protesters , after the hardline men and women threatened violence .
As the protest was winding down , dozens of men tried to push through the barricade , including a man who held a little girl aloft on his shoulders .
According to a video uploaded to Twitter by a BBC reporter , police used batons to push them back .
Still , for the next few minutes , they hurled projectiles that scattered the women 's day protesters , as journalists huddled behind concrete road dividers .
The hardline groups @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , took to the airwaves preceding the rally to condemn Pakistani feminists , accusing them of encouraging anti-Islamic vulgarity by raising a slogan that hinted that a woman had the right to do as she pleased .
The tensions even boiled over on a live talk show , where a screen writer swore at a prominent Pakistani liberal after she interrupted him by chanting the slogan .
`` Nobody would even spit on your body , '' he shouted in a clip widely shared on social media .
Conservative lawyers petitioned the courts @ @ @ @ @ @ @ ban the women 's marches .
One prominent Islamist opposition leader , known as Maulana Fazl-ur-Rehman , threatened protesters on Feb. 29 , warning them not to chant `` my body , my choice . ''
`` God willing , we will also come out into the streets , and we will destroy you , '' he warned .
And a senior teacher at Jamiat Hafsa , a hardline women 's seminary in the Pakistani capital , told NPR her students would halt the march by organizing a rival `` modesty march .
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ stop that march , '' said the woman , who uses the name Bint Azwa ( the women at the seminary often use first names or fake names to avoid being identified by security institutions that monitor their activities ) .
`` We are not going to let those women march the streets of our country , our neighborhood , with those vulgar chants . ''
The violence underscored how hardline Islamist groups played upon conservative outrage over the slogan `` my body , my choice , '' to assert their presence in @ @ @ @ @ @ @ muscle .
The opposition leader Maulana Fazl-ur-Rehman has struggled to find a toehold in Pakistan 's freewheeling politics since his party was forced into opposition .
The hardline Jamiat Hafsa was violently shut down in 2007 , after a standoff that killed more than 100 people .
The women returned to the seminary only this February , and have dared security forces to remove them again .
On Sunday , dozens of the seminary women turned up at the counter-rally , clad in long black robes , headscarves and face veils , segregated @ @ @ @ @ @ @ a nearby park .
They stood in military-style rows , their fearsome appearance only jarred by blue , green and pink bows pinned to their shoulders , to identify which bus they should return on , explained one 25-year-old , who only gave her first name , Rubina .
`` We do n't want women to make choices for their bodies .
The choice rests with God , '' she said .
Nodding toward the women 's day march , she described the women there as `` naked . ''
`` These people @ @ @ @ @ @ @ she exclaimed , referring to the shawl that Pakistani women traditionally drape across their chests to signify modesty .
On the other side , at the women 's march , hundreds of men , women and transgender Pakistanis clustered .
Some waved the red flag of a leftist party .
Others held up signs , including `` my body , my choice , '' but they denounced so-called `` honor '' killings , where men murder their female relatives for bringing alleged shame onto the family .
Some demanded to know the fate @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
`` Pakistan is getting more and more divided over time , '' said Ambreen Gilani , a 41-year-old development consultant , gesturing to the Islamists across the road .
The opposition to the women 's march helped motivate another protester to turn up , Sukaina Kazmi , a chemical engineer .
She gestured to her Muslim headscarf , `` Our religion does not teach us any of the things they are standing up against , our religion actually does fight for women 's rights , '' she said .
As the protesters @ @ @ @ @ @ @ of men trying to assault them , one organizer , Anam Rathor , said the violence underscored why they were demonstrating .
`` This proves our point , and this movement is growing .
And now we will have more people .
The reason why they are throwing stones is because they are afraid of us and that makes us happy . ''

International Women's Day: With Shoes And Stones, Islamists Disrupt Pakistan Rally
Enlarge this image toggle caption Diaa Hadid/NPR Diaa Hadid/NPR
Demonstrators belonging to Islamist groups attacked an International Women's Day rally in the Pakistani capital Islamabad on Sunday, hurling rocks, chunks of mud and even their shoes. The demonstrators, who were at a rival rally held by hardline Islamist organizations, were particularly enraged by one slogan the women's day rally adopted: "mera jism, mera marzi" – "my body, my choice."
Riot police set up large cloth barricades to dive the rival rallies, which flanked either side of a main road. But the police were also there to protect the women's day protesters, after the hardline men and women threatened violence.
As the protest was winding down, dozens of men tried to push through the barricade, including a man who held a little girl aloft on his shoulders. According to a video uploaded to Twitter by a BBC reporter, police used batons to push them back. Still, for the next few minutes, they hurled projectiles that scattered the women's day protesters, as journalists huddled behind concrete road dividers.
The hardline groups, their surrogates and conservative talking heads, took to the airwaves preceding the rally to condemn Pakistani feminists, accusing them of encouraging anti-Islamic vulgarity by raising a slogan that hinted that a woman had the right to do as she pleased.
The tensions even boiled over on a live talk show, where a screen writer swore at a prominent Pakistani liberal after she interrupted him by chanting the slogan. "Nobody would even spit on your body," he shouted in a clip widely shared on social media.
Enlarge this image toggle caption Diaa Hadid/NPR Diaa Hadid/NPR
Conservative lawyers petitioned the courts in Pakistan's three cities to try ban the women's marches. One prominent Islamist opposition leader, known as Maulana Fazl-ur-Rehman, threatened protesters on Feb. 29, warning them not to chant "my body, my choice." "God willing, we will also come out into the streets, and we will destroy you," he warned. And a senior teacher at Jamiat Hafsa, a hardline women's seminary in the Pakistani capital, told NPR her students would halt the march by organizing a rival "modesty march."
"This is a march to stop that march," said the woman, who uses the name Bint Azwa (the women at the seminary often use first names or fake names to avoid being identified by security institutions that monitor their activities). "We are not going to let those women march the streets of our country, our neighborhood, with those vulgar chants."
The violence underscored how hardline Islamist groups played upon conservative outrage over the slogan "my body, my choice," to assert their presence in the Pakistani capital – and demonstrate their muscle.
The opposition leader Maulana Fazl-ur-Rehman has struggled to find a toehold in Pakistan's freewheeling politics since his party was forced into opposition. The hardline Jamiat Hafsa was violently shut down in 2007, after a standoff that killed more than 100 people. The women returned to the seminary only this February, and have dared security forces to remove them again.
On Sunday, dozens of the seminary women turned up at the counter-rally, clad in long black robes, headscarves and face veils, segregated from dozens of men who stood in a nearby park. They stood in military-style rows, their fearsome appearance only jarred by blue, green and pink bows pinned to their shoulders, to identify which bus they should return on, explained one 25-year-old, who only gave her first name, Rubina.
"We don't want women to make choices for their bodies. The choice rests with God," she said. Nodding toward the women's day march, she described the women there as "naked." "These people don't even wear dupatas," she exclaimed, referring to the shawl that Pakistani women traditionally drape across their chests to signify modesty.
Enlarge this image toggle caption Diaa Hadid/NPR Diaa Hadid/NPR
On the other side, at the women's march, hundreds of men, women and transgender Pakistanis clustered. Some waved the red flag of a leftist party. Others held up signs, including "my body, my choice," but they denounced so-called "honor" killings, where men murder their female relatives for bringing alleged shame onto the family. Some demanded to know the fate of female political activists who mysteriously disappeared.
"Pakistan is getting more and more divided over time," said Ambreen Gilani, a 41-year-old development consultant, gesturing to the Islamists across the road. The opposition to the women's march helped motivate another protester to turn up, Sukaina Kazmi, a chemical engineer. She gestured to her Muslim headscarf, "Our religion does not teach us any of the things they are standing up against, our religion actually does fight for women's rights," she said.
As the protesters regrouped and walked away from the dozens of men trying to assault them, one organizer, Anam Rathor, said the violence underscored why they were demonstrating. "This proves our point, and this movement is growing. And now we will have more people. The reason why they are throwing stones is because they are afraid of us and that makes us happy."


npr--2020-03-08--WHO Official Says Coronavirus Containment Remains Possible

WHO Official Says Coronavirus Containment Remains Possible Even as the number of new coronavirus infections continues to spiral upward in countries around the world , a top global health expert says it 's not too late to contain the virus .
`` As long as you have these discrete outbreaks ... there is the opportunity to control them — to get on top of these and contain them and prevent a lot of disease and ultimately death , '' says Dr. Bruce Aylward , a senior adviser to the director-general of the World Health Organization .
`` That 's the @ @ @ @ @ @ @ and one of the big surprises . ''
Aylward led a fact-finding trip in China in February on behalf of the World Health Organization .
He says the experience there altered his view of what can be done .
`` They actually changed the course of a respiratory-borne outbreak without a vaccine , which was extraordinary , '' says Aylward .
The number of daily new cases in China went from around 2,000 just a few weeks ago to less than 100 in recent days .
But Aylward says other countries may be @ @ @ @ @ @ @ attributing its success to the government 's unprecedented restrictions on daily life in several cities , most famously Wuhan , the city of 11 million people where the outbreak began .
There , the government has suspended transportation out of the city and for the most part required people to remain in their homes — with only brief forays permitted to stock up on food and other supplies .
`` China has 31 provinces , thousands of cities , '' notes Aylward .
`` And it was only a few cities where they @ @ @ @ @ @ @ vast majority of them , they ... really went back to fundamentals of public health . ''
These included ensuring that there was enough testing capacity to quickly identify cases , isolating infected patients , tracing anyone who had contact with them and , when necessary , placing those contacts in quarantine facilities so they would n't get infected by the sick person or spread the disease further .
Also , in places where clusters of cases were emerging , authorities prohibited mass gatherings .
`` That 's how they stopped it in @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , '' says Aylward .
`` We spent two weeks on the ground looking at the data .
Every other province [ beyond Hubei , where Wuhan is located ] had hundreds , if not thousands , of cases , not unlike the situation you see in European countries or in the U.S .
These are massive provinces with tens and even a hundred million people in them . ''
In short , Aylward says , `` it was n't a lockdown everywhere .
That 's the wrong way to portray China 's @ @ @ @ @ @ @ 's leading to some fundamental confusion and failure to do the right things . ''
Is Italy 's decision to impose severe lockdown-like restrictions in vast swaths of its northern region the right approach ?
Aylward says he 's reluctant to comment specifically on Italy 's decision because he 's not familiar with the epidemiological data there .
`` One of the challenges with Italy right now is just the amount of data , '' he says .
`` They 're just running so fast to catch up with the cases , it @ @ @ @ @ @ @ the transmission .
Because that 's what you want to use to drive your strategy — what you cancel , what you suspend , etc .
It should be driven by the way the virus is moving . ''
Still , Aylward says , there is indeed a threshold where it becomes necessary to impose major restrictions on movement .
That happens when there is substantial `` community-level transmission , where it 's spreading in [ so ] many , many different environments , you ca n't even differentiate clusters . ''
That @ @ @ @ @ @ @ even in those instances , says Aylward , it 's crucial not to rely on restrictions of movement as the sole remedy .
Public health authorities need to be prepared for a rebound in cases when movement restrictions are lifted and cases start to tick up again .
`` When I talk to governors of provinces [ in China ] , mayors of cities and ask them , 'What are you doing now ? '
— they say , 'We 're building beds for isolation , and we 're buying ventilators to help @ @ @ @ @ @ @ ' `` Aylward says .
`` And the interesting thing is ... you 're seeing falling disease in these massive provinces in China , and they 're building capacity . ''
Meanwhile , he adds , in Europe and the United States , authorities are still struggling to manage far fewer cases .
`` I mean , it 's a completely different willingness to properly prepare . ''
How have delays in coronavirus testing affected the ability of the United States to get ready ?
`` Well , it complicates your response , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , `` We are where we are .
...
The important thing is looking forward .
You 've seen [ this disease 's ] potential to spread for weeks , and you need plans to be able to isolate dozens , if not hundreds , of people , to be able to trace ... many , many contacts .
And you have to be able to test . ''
Even if it 's not possible to fully stop the spread , he says , `` you can still slow it down and protect @ @ @ @ @ @ @ of damage that this disease can do . ''

WHO Official Says Coronavirus Containment Remains Possible
Enlarge this image toggle caption Fabrice Coffrini/AFP via Getty Images Fabrice Coffrini/AFP via Getty Images
Even as the number of new coronavirus infections continues to spiral upward in countries around the world, a top global health expert says it's not too late to contain the virus.
"As long as you have these discrete outbreaks ... there is the opportunity to control them — to get on top of these and contain them and prevent a lot of disease and ultimately death," says Dr. Bruce Aylward, a senior adviser to the director-general of the World Health Organization. "That's the big message we saw in China — and one of the big surprises."
Aylward led a fact-finding trip in China in February on behalf of the World Health Organization. He says the experience there altered his view of what can be done.
"They actually changed the course of a respiratory-borne outbreak without a vaccine, which was extraordinary," says Aylward. The number of daily new cases in China went from around 2,000 just a few weeks ago to less than 100 in recent days.
But Aylward says other countries may be taking the wrong lesson from China by attributing its success to the government's unprecedented restrictions on daily life in several cities, most famously Wuhan, the city of 11 million people where the outbreak began. There, the government has suspended transportation out of the city and for the most part required people to remain in their homes — with only brief forays permitted to stock up on food and other supplies.
"China has 31 provinces, thousands of cities," notes Aylward. "And it was only a few cities where they took those draconian measures. In the vast majority of them, they ... really went back to fundamentals of public health."
These included ensuring that there was enough testing capacity to quickly identify cases, isolating infected patients, tracing anyone who had contact with them and, when necessary, placing those contacts in quarantine facilities so they wouldn't get infected by the sick person or spread the disease further. Also, in places where clusters of cases were emerging, authorities prohibited mass gatherings.
"That's how they stopped it in the areas with over 1.3 billion people," says Aylward. "We spent two weeks on the ground looking at the data. Every other province [beyond Hubei, where Wuhan is located] had hundreds, if not thousands, of cases, not unlike the situation you see in European countries or in the U.S. These are massive provinces with tens and even a hundred million people in them."
In short, Aylward says, "it wasn't a lockdown everywhere. That's the wrong way to portray China's approach to the disease. And that's leading to some fundamental confusion and failure to do the right things."
Is Italy's decision to impose severe lockdown-like restrictions in vast swaths of its northern region the right approach?
Aylward says he's reluctant to comment specifically on Italy's decision because he's not familiar with the epidemiological data there. "One of the challenges with Italy right now is just the amount of data," he says. "They're just running so fast to catch up with the cases, it's difficult to understand what's driving the transmission. Because that's what you want to use to drive your strategy — what you cancel, what you suspend, etc. It should be driven by the way the virus is moving."
Still, Aylward says, there is indeed a threshold where it becomes necessary to impose major restrictions on movement. That happens when there is substantial "community-level transmission, where it's spreading in [so] many, many different environments, you can't even differentiate clusters." That's what occurred in Wuhan.
But even in those instances, says Aylward, it's crucial not to rely on restrictions of movement as the sole remedy. Public health authorities need to be prepared for a rebound in cases when movement restrictions are lifted and cases start to tick up again.
"When I talk to governors of provinces [in China], mayors of cities and ask them, 'What are you doing now?' — they say, 'We're building beds for isolation, and we're buying ventilators to help take care of the very sick,' " Aylward says. "And the interesting thing is ... you're seeing falling disease in these massive provinces in China, and they're building capacity."
Meanwhile, he adds, in Europe and the United States, authorities are still struggling to manage far fewer cases. "I mean, it's a completely different willingness to properly prepare."
How have delays in coronavirus testing affected the ability of the United States to get ready?
"Well, it complicates your response," says Aylward. But he says, "We are where we are. ... The important thing is looking forward. You've seen [this disease's] potential to spread for weeks, and you need plans to be able to isolate dozens, if not hundreds, of people, to be able to trace ... many, many contacts. And you have to be able to test."
Even if it's not possible to fully stop the spread, he says, "you can still slow it down and protect the vulnerable populations and limit the amount of damage that this disease can do."


npr--2020-03-08--Documentary 'The Trade' Gives Human And Heartbreaking Look At The Immigration Crisis

Documentary 'The Trade ' Gives Human And Heartbreaking Look At The Immigration Crisis A new documentary series on Showtime gives a very human and heartbreaking look at the immigration crisis on our southern border .
`` The Trade '' follows the lives of migrants and smugglers , victims and survivors , border officials and the undocumented living in the United States .
The filmmakers gained incredible access in Honduras and Mexico and with U.S. law enforcement to tell this story of human trafficking .
Monica Villamizar is one of the producers .
And she joins me now in the studio @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
MONICA VILLAMIZAR : Thank you for having me .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : There are so many storylines running through these episodes because , of course , immigration is such a complicated issue .
One of the ones that you worked on that was particularly compelling is the story of Magda .
Tell us about her .
VILLAMIZAR : Magda - we met her - it was really , like , terrible circumstances because we were with a forensics team , and we heard about a young man who had been murdered .
It @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , who was shot .
And we went to the crime scene .
And she was n't there because the story is that he was part of MS-13 .
He tried to leave many - the gang many times , several times .
And then one day he said , I ca n't do this anymore .
They tried to migrate .
They were deported in Mexico .
He gets back .
And the MS tracks him down and kills him .
She was in another town in Honduras .
So it took @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Pedro Sula for the funeral .
And two days later , I met her at the funeral .
And she was with the baby Monse ( ph ) , the little girl .
And she said , you know , MS is going to kill me now because I know too much about the gang .
And they know we tried to leave .
We tried to leave with other gang members .
And I need to flee .
So I told her - you know , can we follow you ?
What @ @ @ @ @ @ @ said , I have no plans .
I need to go with a man .
Turned out Rossni , her brother-in-law , you know , said , I 'm going to go in and look after you and the baby .
And they had very , very little money .
They waited for two months to gather some money for the trip .
But they had , really , no plan and just went up north .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : And there is a breathtaking scene because you follow her north where she 's @ @ @ @ @ @ @ onto the beast , which is this very well known to migrants moving freight train going north through Mexico .
VILLAMIZAR : She was pregnant , as well .
I then found out she was pregnant .
So that made it all the more difficult .
I mean , it 's really - you need to be quite athletic to get on that moving train .
And you have to climb on top .
When you 're exposed , obviously , to the weather , it 's very cold at night .
People @ @ @ @ @ @ @ fall off .
People lose limbs trying to get on and off the train .
I mean , it 's extremely dangerous .
So that 's Magda 's story .
But you also introduce us to a woman who runs a smuggling operation .
She boasts that her stash houses for migrants en route are comfortable , with air conditioning and TV .
You know , that 's surprising to many people .
VILLAMIZAR : It was very - it was fascinating .
I think women who are living in the underworld , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ the men criminals I 've met covering , you know , the drug wars , et cetera .
She 's a mother .
She 's very careful and concerned about her appearance .
She wears this - you know , very sort of tight-fitting clothes and heels , as you saw in , you know , some of the details .
And she 's still also very brave , very ruthless .
And she boasts that she 's very professional .
You know , in the area where we filmed , the cartels @ @ @ @ @ @ @ you - people have to pay a quota to the cartels .
And she was always very proud of her accounting .
And she said , you know , it 's a man 's world .
But I work , you know , four times as hard as a man .
And I - you know , I keep my accounting so well that I 'm the best at this .
And I want to be the best .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : You 're someone who has covered the drug wars in Latin America @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , as well .
What did you learn ?
You went into this trying to understand immigration .
What did you learn coming out of it ?
VILLAMIZAR : One thing that I learned is that I really think smuggling is not going to stop , for instance , no matter what the policy is .
These people seem to be sort of almost , like , ahead of the curve .
And I 've kept in touch with a lot of people that - you know , smugglers that we met because @ @ @ @ @ @ @ are not actually in the film .
And there 's always sort of an aftereffect after a policy is implemented .
But then they kind of figure it out .
And it 's almost like - you know , like drug smuggling , as well - drug trafficking .
They 're always ahead of the curve .
They 'll always find ways to circumvent a certain policy .
So I think it 's not going to stop .
I mean , I think it really needs to be - immigration as a whole @ @ @ @ @ @ @ different way because , clearly , things in place are not working .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : That 's Monica Villamizar , one of the producers of `` The Trade , '' which is now airing on Showtime .
Thank you so much .
VILLAMIZAR : Thank you so much , Lulu .

Documentary 'The Trade' Gives Human And Heartbreaking Look At The Immigration Crisis
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, HOST:
A new documentary series on Showtime gives a very human and heartbreaking look at the immigration crisis on our southern border. "The Trade" follows the lives of migrants and smugglers, victims and survivors, border officials and the undocumented living in the United States. The filmmakers gained incredible access in Honduras and Mexico and with U.S. law enforcement to tell this story of human trafficking. Monica Villamizar is one of the producers. And she joins me now in the studio. Thanks so much for being here.
MONICA VILLAMIZAR: Thank you for having me.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: There are so many storylines running through these episodes because, of course, immigration is such a complicated issue. One of the ones that you worked on that was particularly compelling is the story of Magda. Tell us about her.
VILLAMIZAR: Magda - we met her - it was really, like, terrible circumstances because we were with a forensics team, and we heard about a young man who had been murdered. It turned out he was Magda's husband, who was shot. And we went to the crime scene. And she wasn't there because the story is that he was part of MS-13. He tried to leave many - the gang many times, several times. And then one day he said, I can't do this anymore. They tried to migrate. They were deported in Mexico. He gets back. And the MS tracks him down and kills him. She was in another town in Honduras. So it took her two days to get to San Pedro Sula for the funeral.
And two days later, I met her at the funeral. And she was with the baby Monse (ph), the little girl. And she said, you know, MS is going to kill me now because I know too much about the gang. And they know we tried to leave. We tried to leave with other gang members. And I need to flee. So I told her - you know, can we follow you? What are your plans? And she basically said, I have no plans. I need to go with a man. Turned out Rossni, her brother-in-law, you know, said, I'm going to go in and look after you and the baby. And they had very, very little money. They waited for two months to gather some money for the trip. But they had, really, no plan and just went up north.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And there is a breathtaking scene because you follow her north where she's holding her baby and she's leaping onto the beast, which is this very well known to migrants moving freight train going north through Mexico.
(SOUNDBITE OF TV SHOW, "THE TRADE")
MAGDA: (Non-English language spoken).
(CROSSTALK)
VILLAMIZAR: She was pregnant, as well. I then found out she was pregnant. So that made it all the more difficult. I mean, it's really - you need to be quite athletic to get on that moving train. And you have to climb on top. When you're exposed, obviously, to the weather, it's very cold at night. People huddle together.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And people fall off. People lose limbs trying to get on and off the train. I mean, it's extremely dangerous. So that's Magda's story. But you also introduce us to a woman who runs a smuggling operation. She boasts that her stash houses for migrants en route are comfortable, with air conditioning and TV. You know, that's surprising to many people.
VILLAMIZAR: It was very - it was fascinating. I think women who are living in the underworld, women criminals are way more interesting than the men criminals I've met covering, you know, the drug wars, et cetera. She's a mother. She's very careful and concerned about her appearance. She wears this - you know, very sort of tight-fitting clothes and heels, as you saw in, you know, some of the details. And she's still also very brave, very ruthless. And she boasts that she's very professional. You know, in the area where we filmed, the cartels control all the smuggling business. So you - people have to pay a quota to the cartels. And she was always very proud of her accounting. And she said, you know, it's a man's world. But I work, you know, four times as hard as a man. And I - you know, I keep my accounting so well that I'm the best at this. And I want to be the best.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: You're someone who has covered the drug wars in Latin America for a very long time and migration, as well. What did you learn? You went into this trying to understand immigration. What did you learn coming out of it?
VILLAMIZAR: One thing that I learned is that I really think smuggling is not going to stop, for instance, no matter what the policy is. These people seem to be sort of almost, like, ahead of the curve. And I've kept in touch with a lot of people that - you know, smugglers that we met because we cast many, many people that are not actually in the film. And there's always sort of an aftereffect after a policy is implemented. But then they kind of figure it out. And it's almost like - you know, like drug smuggling, as well - drug trafficking. They're always ahead of the curve. They'll always find ways to circumvent a certain policy. So I think it's not going to stop. I mean, I think it really needs to be - immigration as a whole needs to be thought of in a different way because, clearly, things in place are not working.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: That's Monica Villamizar, one of the producers of "The Trade," which is now airing on Showtime. Thank you so much.
VILLAMIZAR: Thank you so much, Lulu.
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npr--2020-03-08--Your Questions On Coronavirus: You Asked, We Answered

Your Questions On Coronavirus : You Asked , We Answered On yesterday 's program , we asked listeners to send in their questions about COVID-19 .
Now we 'd like Allison Aubrey from NPR 's Science Desk to provide some answers .
We start with Flo Schumacher ( ph ) from Chicago .
FLO SCHUMACHER : So my question about the coronavirus is that I know that colds are also caused by the coronavirus , and I was wondering , are these a related coronavirus ?
Like , how are they the same ?
And how are they different ?
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ coronaviruses are a large family of viruses .
And yes , some coronaviruses lead to what we think of as the common cold .
But what is spreading around the globe now is a new coronavirus .
It clearly can lead to more serious illness in some people .
In others , the symptoms are very similar to what you have with the common colds you get - the dry cough .
You can get a bit of fever .
Of course , the reason for the concern now is that this new @ @ @ @ @ @ @ led to lots of serious illness and deaths .
So there is concern .
And yes , this is more serious than the common cold .
ROBERT JOHNSON : My name is Robert Johnson ( ph ) .
I 'm calling from Astoria , Ore. We have heard that older people are at a higher risk of COVID-19 .
At first , I heard the age 60 .
And now I 'm hearing 70 .
I would like to understand more of what about age makes one more susceptible .
Or is age @ @ @ @ @ @ @ ?
AUBREY : Generally speaking , older people do seem to be at higher risk .
That is certainly what has been documented in China .
The average age of death from the coronavirus in China - at least what 's been reported so far - has been in the 70s .
And it 's important to point out that the virus seems to hit older men and smokers particularly hard , as well as people with underlying health problems - so respiratory disease , cardiovascular disease .
Among the experts that I @ @ @ @ @ @ @ consensus that people with these diseases and habits , such as smoking , are at increased risk of serious illness .
ROBERTA ARONA : Hi .
Roberta Arona ( ph ) from Fontana , Calif. My biggest coronavirus question is , are kids immune to the virus ?
Is it only adults that get it ?
AUBREY : Well , kids are not immune to this new coronavirus .
They do get it .
But the studies that have come out of China document that small children who get infected tend to have @ @ @ @ @ @ @ 's important to point out that what 's come out of China - and now we 're not just talking about children - we 're talking about all of the cases - about 80 % of the cases have been very mild , meaning people get sick with fever , a cough .
And in some cases , that has meant pneumonia .
That has been categorized as mild disease .
So yeah , in some cases , it looks nothing more than a common cold .
And other cases - much more @ @ @ @ @ @ @ we got this question from Elizabeth Bird ( ph ) of Bozeman , Mont .
And I 'm going to paraphrase it here - so no answering machine beep this time .
Allison , she wants to know how long the virus can live on surfaces like chairs or pieces of mail .
That 's an important question .
AUBREY : So the way that this virus is thought to spread is via respiratory droplets .
And what that means is that when an infected person sneezes or coughs , little droplets containing @ @ @ @ @ @ @ of your mouth or come out of your nose .
And then what happens is if a person is walking by and one of these little droplets lands on that person - that person then touches their eyes - nose or mouth , they can be infected .
That 's how you get this person-to-person transmission .
What we know so far is that these viruses can land on surfaces and contaminate them .
But the virus is not thought to live very long on these surfaces .
Nobody can say precisely .
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ by several infectious disease experts is that they tend to live on surfaces for hours - certainly not for days .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : NPR 's Allison Aubrey .
Allison , thank you so much .
AUBREY : All right .
Thank you very much .

Your Questions On Coronavirus: You Asked, We Answered
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, HOST:
On yesterday's program, we asked listeners to send in their questions about COVID-19. Now we'd like Allison Aubrey from NPR's Science Desk to provide some answers. We start with Flo Schumacher (ph) from Chicago.
(SOUNDBITE OF BEEP)
FLO SCHUMACHER: So my question about the coronavirus is that I know that colds are also caused by the coronavirus, and I was wondering, are these a related coronavirus? Like, how are they the same? And how are they different?
ALLISON AUBREY, BYLINE: Well, coronaviruses are a large family of viruses. And yes, some coronaviruses lead to what we think of as the common cold. But what is spreading around the globe now is a new coronavirus. It clearly can lead to more serious illness in some people. In others, the symptoms are very similar to what you have with the common colds you get - the dry cough. You can get a bit of fever. Of course, the reason for the concern now is that this new coronavirus is very contagious and has certainly led to lots of serious illness and deaths. So there is concern. And yes, this is more serious than the common cold.
(SOUNDBITE OF BEEP)
ROBERT JOHNSON: My name is Robert Johnson (ph). I'm calling from Astoria, Ore. We have heard that older people are at a higher risk of COVID-19. At first, I heard the age 60. And now I'm hearing 70. I would like to understand more of what about age makes one more susceptible. Or is age just a convenient proxy for general health?
AUBREY: Generally speaking, older people do seem to be at higher risk. That is certainly what has been documented in China. The average age of death from the coronavirus in China - at least what's been reported so far - has been in the 70s. And it's important to point out that the virus seems to hit older men and smokers particularly hard, as well as people with underlying health problems - so respiratory disease, cardiovascular disease. Among the experts that I've spoken to, there is a consensus that people with these diseases and habits, such as smoking, are at increased risk of serious illness.
(SOUNDBITE OF BEEP)
ROBERTA ARONA: Hi. Roberta Arona (ph) from Fontana, Calif. My biggest coronavirus question is, are kids immune to the virus? Is it only adults that get it?
AUBREY: Well, kids are not immune to this new coronavirus. They do get it. But the studies that have come out of China document that small children who get infected tend to have very, very mild symptoms. It's important to point out that what's come out of China - and now we're not just talking about children - we're talking about all of the cases - about 80% of the cases have been very mild, meaning people get sick with fever, a cough. And in some cases, that has meant pneumonia. That has been categorized as mild disease. So yeah, in some cases, it looks nothing more than a common cold. And other cases - much more serious symptoms.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And finally we got this question from Elizabeth Bird (ph) of Bozeman, Mont. And I'm going to paraphrase it here - so no answering machine beep this time. Allison, she wants to know how long the virus can live on surfaces like chairs or pieces of mail. That's an important question.
AUBREY: So the way that this virus is thought to spread is via respiratory droplets. And what that means is that when an infected person sneezes or coughs, little droplets containing virus, you know, come out of your mouth or come out of your nose. And then what happens is if a person is walking by and one of these little droplets lands on that person - that person then touches their eyes - nose or mouth, they can be infected. That's how you get this person-to-person transmission. What we know so far is that these viruses can land on surfaces and contaminate them. But the virus is not thought to live very long on these surfaces. Nobody can say precisely. But the estimates I've been given by several infectious disease experts is that they tend to live on surfaces for hours - certainly not for days.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: NPR's Allison Aubrey. Allison, thank you so much.
AUBREY: All right. Thank you very much.
(SOUNDBITE OF DOM LA NENA SONG, "NO MEU PAIS")
Copyright © 2020 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.


npr--2020-03-08--How Important Are The Black And Latino Votes In This Election?

How Important Are The Black And Latino Votes In This Election ?
NPR 's Lulu Garcia-Navarro talks to political scientists Victoria DeFrancesco Soto and Christina Greer about the importance — and nuances — of black and Latino voters in the Democratic primaries .
Two vital constituencies of the Democratic Party - African Americans and Latinos - but two very different candidates they 're backing .
We 're joined now by two political scientists , Christina Greer and Victoria DeFrancesco Soto , to help explain how this might play out in what has become essentially a race between Joe Biden and @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Welcome to the program .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Christina , we 'll start with you .
In the first tests of states with significant black populations , black voters turned out big for Joe Biden .
What 's driving that support ?
GREER : Well , indeed .
I mean , he has James Clyburn to thank , first and foremost .
GREER : But black voters are strategic and pragmatic .
And I think that a lot of black voters are thinking very seriously about November 3 .
I think that they see @ @ @ @ @ @ @ And I think that , you know , Joe Biden may not be the most perfect vessel .
But of the choices they were given , I think a strategic choice was made that he would be the one that could galvanize sort of establishment support and face Donald Trump in November .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Yeah .
I mean , you mentioned Jim Clyburn of South Carolina .
And he said when endorsing Biden , I am fearful of the future of this country .
That clearly is something that is driving African @ @ @ @ @ @ @ , of course , have experienced discrimination , racism , the legacy of Jim Crow .
GREER : Right .
But I mean , we have to remember , as Malcolm X said , all - you know , anything south of the Canadian border is the U.S. South .
And so oftentimes , we like to put race and racism on the U.S. South .
But what 's really key is when James Clyburn said , we know Joe , right ?
GARCIA-NAVARRO : And he knows us .
GREER : And @ @ @ @ @ @ @ the specific line where - does Bernie Sanders know us ?
GARCIA-NAVARRO : All right .
Victoria , Sanders has gotten a big boost from Latino support in Nevada and other states .
What do some Latinos see in Sanders ?
DEFRANCESCO SOTO : Right .
So zooming out , we see that he had a huge victory when it came to the Latino electorate .
Now , where does that support come from ?
It 's a combination of , number one , a very intense and well-coordinated ground game .
There @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Because it 's always been a huge issue for Latinos .
DEFRANCESCO SOTO : Well , yeah .
And Latinos are the most underinsured population .
So when a Bernie Sanders comes out and says , we want health care for all , that is a particularly strong message that resonates with Latinos .
And then , you know , Biden did not come into Texas and California and court the Latino vote .
I 'm not saying he did n't want to , but he did n't have the @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Christina , my question is about enthusiasm and voter turnout .
The black vote is crucial in many of the states that are going to decide who becomes the next president of the United States .
I mean , is there enthusiasm for Joe Biden enough to really motivate people to come out from the black community ?
GREER : Well , I mean , we have a long road to November .
But you know , when black turnout is low , we also have to look at some of the institutional @ @ @ @ @ @ @ put in front of black voters .
You know , we saw this in Texas , where the black and Latinx communities - many of their polling places have been systematically closed .
I think sometimes , you know , a lot of pressure is placed on black shoulders to carry the Democratic Party across the finish line .
We need to make sure that Joe Biden is speaking articulately about issues that black Americans and Latinx communities in places like Michigan and Wisconsin care about .
And I think it 'll really @ @ @ @ @ @ @ to make sure people know that we have imperfect candidates , but anything is better than another four years of the Republican administration under Donald Trump .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Victoria , same question to you but the reverse .
I mean , there 's always been this expectation that the Latino vote is going to be crucial .
It 's a huge constituency , largest minority voting in the 2020 election .
Are we going to see them coming out in big numbers if Bernie Sanders is the nominee and if Joe Biden @ @ @ @ @ @ @ So we know that Latinos have historically been the group that 's least likely to turn out and vote .
We did see a blip on the radar screen in 2018 , a jump of about 50 % turnout for Latinos , which seemed to indicate there might be something going on here .
So I 'm cautiously optimistic that we see a pattern of Latinos turning out to vote in greater numbers because we know from political science that when someone turns out to vote , they 're more likely to do @ @ @ @ @ @ @ have become so high in this election for many of the issues that Latinos care the most about , namely health care , inequality and immigration .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Finally , to you both - I mean , looking beyond 2020 , I mean , we are most likely going to have a battle between President Trump and , you know , a septuagenarian white man .
That has been a great disappointment to many within the Democratic Party , specifically communities of color .
What has gone well , and what do @ @ @ @ @ @ @ GREER : Well , I think after 2020 , the Democratic Party really needs to look at itself and ask how it was that they had over 20 candidates , many of whom - women , people of color , highly qualified - and those candidates of color were oftentimes the first to have to drop out of the race .
That 's going to be a hard conversation going forward in 2024 .
DEFRANCESCO SOTO : I think the fact that we have an Iowa and then a New Hampshire first very @ @ @ @ @ @ @ matters , so if we can work on changing the institutional rules that govern our primary system , I think it will give candidates of color a better shot .
GREER : I agree with you , Vicky .
And I think that there 's still too much emphasis on this amorphous white , working-class voter that people are still chasing .
And they need to actually start tapping into black , Latinx and Asian voters , many of whom are still sitting on the sidelines because no one 's bothered to ask @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Greer is a political scientist with Fordham University 's Lincoln Center .
And Victoria DeFrancesco Soto is an assistant dean for civic engagement at the LBJ School of Public Affairs at the University of Texas .
Thank you both very much .

How Important Are The Black And Latino Votes In This Election?
NPR's Lulu Garcia-Navarro talks to political scientists Victoria DeFrancesco Soto and Christina Greer about the importance — and nuances — of black and Latino voters in the Democratic primaries.
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, HOST:
Two vital constituencies of the Democratic Party - African Americans and Latinos - but two very different candidates they're backing. We're joined now by two political scientists, Christina Greer and Victoria DeFrancesco Soto, to help explain how this might play out in what has become essentially a race between Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders for the Democratic nomination.
Welcome to the program.
VICTORIA DEFRANCESCO SOTO: Thank you.
CHRISTINA GREER: Thank you.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Christina, we'll start with you. In the first tests of states with significant black populations, black voters turned out big for Joe Biden. What's driving that support?
GREER: Well, indeed. I mean, he has James Clyburn to thank, first and foremost.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: That's right.
GREER: But black voters are strategic and pragmatic. And I think that a lot of black voters are thinking very seriously about November 3. I think that they see Donald Trump as a real threat. And I think that, you know, Joe Biden may not be the most perfect vessel. But of the choices they were given, I think a strategic choice was made that he would be the one that could galvanize sort of establishment support and face Donald Trump in November.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Yeah. I mean, you mentioned Jim Clyburn of South Carolina. And he said when endorsing Biden, I am fearful of the future of this country. That clearly is something that is driving African Americans who, specifically in the South, of course, have experienced discrimination, racism, the legacy of Jim Crow.
GREER: Right. But I mean, we have to remember, as Malcolm X said, all - you know, anything south of the Canadian border is the U.S. South. And so oftentimes, we like to put race and racism on the U.S. South. But what's really key is when James Clyburn said, we know Joe, right?
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And he knows us.
GREER: And he knows us. And that is the specific line where - does Bernie Sanders know us?
GARCIA-NAVARRO: All right. Victoria, Sanders has gotten a big boost from Latino support in Nevada and other states. What do some Latinos see in Sanders?
DEFRANCESCO SOTO: Right. So zooming out, we see that he had a huge victory when it came to the Latino electorate. Now, where does that support come from? It's a combination of, number one, a very intense and well-coordinated ground game. There's also the piece of health care.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Because it's always been a huge issue for Latinos.
DEFRANCESCO SOTO: Well, yeah. And Latinos are the most underinsured population. So when a Bernie Sanders comes out and says, we want health care for all, that is a particularly strong message that resonates with Latinos. And then, you know, Biden did not come into Texas and California and court the Latino vote. I'm not saying he didn't want to, but he didn't have the resources to do it.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Christina, my question is about enthusiasm and voter turnout. The black vote is crucial in many of the states that are going to decide who becomes the next president of the United States. I mean, is there enthusiasm for Joe Biden enough to really motivate people to come out from the black community?
GREER: Well, I mean, we have a long road to November. But you know, when black turnout is low, we also have to look at some of the institutional barriers that...
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Of course.
GREER: ...Are put in front of black voters. You know, we saw this in Texas, where the black and Latinx communities - many of their polling places have been systematically closed. I think sometimes, you know, a lot of pressure is placed on black shoulders to carry the Democratic Party across the finish line. We need to make sure that Joe Biden is speaking articulately about issues that black Americans and Latinx communities in places like Michigan and Wisconsin care about. And I think it'll really be an articulation of ideas and values to make sure people know that we have imperfect candidates, but anything is better than another four years of the Republican administration under Donald Trump.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Victoria, same question to you but the reverse. I mean, there's always been this expectation that the Latino vote is going to be crucial. It's a huge constituency, largest minority voting in the 2020 election. Are we going to see them coming out in big numbers if Bernie Sanders is the nominee and if Joe Biden is the nominee?
DEFRANCESCO SOTO: So we know that Latinos have historically been the group that's least likely to turn out and vote. We did see a blip on the radar screen in 2018, a jump of about 50% turnout for Latinos, which seemed to indicate there might be something going on here. So I'm cautiously optimistic that we see a pattern of Latinos turning out to vote in greater numbers because we know from political science that when someone turns out to vote, they're more likely to do it again and also that the stakes have become so high in this election for many of the issues that Latinos care the most about, namely health care, inequality and immigration.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Finally, to you both - I mean, looking beyond 2020, I mean, we are most likely going to have a battle between President Trump and, you know, a septuagenarian white man. That has been a great disappointment to many within the Democratic Party, specifically communities of color. What has gone well, and what do you think needs to change further?
GREER: Well, I think after 2020, the Democratic Party really needs to look at itself and ask how it was that they had over 20 candidates, many of whom - women, people of color, highly qualified - and those candidates of color were oftentimes the first to have to drop out of the race. That's going to be a hard conversation going forward in 2024.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Victoria.
DEFRANCESCO SOTO: I think the fact that we have an Iowa and then a New Hampshire first very much hurts candidates of color. Order matters, so if we can work on changing the institutional rules that govern our primary system, I think it will give candidates of color a better shot.
GREER: I agree with you, Vicky. And I think that there's still too much emphasis on this amorphous white, working-class voter that people are still chasing. And they need to actually start tapping into black, Latinx and Asian voters, many of whom are still sitting on the sidelines because no one's bothered to ask them to participate.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Christina Greer is a political scientist with Fordham University's Lincoln Center. And Victoria DeFrancesco Soto is an assistant dean for civic engagement at the LBJ School of Public Affairs at the University of Texas.
Thank you both very much.
GREER: Thank you.
DEFRANCESCO SOTO: Thank you, Lulu.
Copyright © 2020 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.


npr--2020-03-08--A Look At Seattle, The City At Epicenter Of The Coronavirus Outbreak In The U.S.

A Look At Seattle , The City At Epicenter Of The Coronavirus Outbreak In The U.S. Seattle is currently the epicenter of the coronavirus outbreak in the United States .
Most of the deaths associated with the virus have been traced to a suburban nursing home there .
Microsoft and Amazon , major local employers , are curtailing travel and urging telework .
Colleges are canceling in-person classes , and we 're now going to check in with how hospitals and health workers are coping .
Brandon Fainstad is an internist at a hospital just south of Seattle , and @ @ @ @ @ @ @ so much for being with us .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Tell me a little bit about how things have been .
Have you been in contact with a COVID-19 patient ?
FAINSTAD : Sure .
Yeah , I have n't been personally taking care of the one COVID-positive patient that we 've confirmed at our hospital .
And for obvious reasons , it 's been a bit chaotic at our hospital , mostly around trying to consolidate information and policy as we 're learning more and more every day and trying to adjust .
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : I can imagine .
And explain a little bit about what 's been happening at home .
FAINSTAD : Yeah , my wife is a primary care doctor in Seattle .
And she had new symptoms that would be potentially consistent with COVID-19 and , following UW and CDC guidelines , has remained away from work and probably wo n't return until at least 24 to 72 hours after the cough resolves .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Has she been tested ?
FAINSTAD : No .
That 's been a real struggle @ @ @ @ @ @ @ We 're not concerned about her health .
We 're not concerned about the health of our kids and myself .
But we want to be careful about participating in the spread of the virus .
We do n't want to be vector within our community , and we certainly do n't want to expose our vulnerable patients .
So it 's nice to know whether you 're positive because you can be even more rigorous with your quarantine practice .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : I was reading a report from The New York Times @ @ @ @ @ @ @ into contact with one patient who may have tested positive for COVID-19 went into quarantine - 40 health care workers .
And that seems to me to be unsustainable and could jeopardize the resilience of the health care system .
FAINSTAD : Yeah , I think that is a very real concern that we have .
And we do n't want to have a disproportionate response to a positive test .
And I think that probably plays into the calculus of our hospital systems deciding to or to not broadly test , even @ @ @ @ @ @ @ And we just do n't know enough about how infectious it is at the pre-symptomatic , symptomatic or post-symptomatic periods .
And I agree with you - COVID-19 is a real concern .
But to be honest , there is a lot of non-COVID-19 health needs in our community .
And we do n't want to reduce our health care staff capacity at the risk of not being able to help people with other conditions .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Are you surprised by how this has really shown some weaknesses in the American health @ @ @ @ @ @ @ It 's , in many ways , a perfect storm .
Our government response obviously has n't satisfied the immediate needs of our population , and I think that could probably be viewed more than one way .
You know , it could be demonstrating the limits of centralized government .
But at the same time , the CDC has been defunded over years , and a centralized response to an epidemiologic threat like this is only as good as the policy 's staffing and funding behind it .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : And how @ @ @ @ @ @ @ you think she might be able to be tested ?
FAINSTAD : Yeah .
You know , I do n't know .
UW virology lab reported just yesterday that they 're capable of testing a thousand people a day .
And then - you know , that very well may be true from a lab standpoint .
But from a point-of-care standpoint , it has n't happened .
And there 's staffing and resource limitations outside of what the lab itself can do .
So I do n't know .
I wish I @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Brandon Fainstad speaking to us from near Seattle .
Thank you very much .
FAINSTAD : You 're welcome .
Thank you .

A Look At Seattle, The City At Epicenter Of The Coronavirus Outbreak In The U.S.
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, HOST:
Seattle is currently the epicenter of the coronavirus outbreak in the United States. Most of the deaths associated with the virus have been traced to a suburban nursing home there. Microsoft and Amazon, major local employers, are curtailing travel and urging telework. Colleges are canceling in-person classes, and we're now going to check in with how hospitals and health workers are coping.
Brandon Fainstad is an internist at a hospital just south of Seattle, and he joins us now. Thank you so much for being with us.
BRANDON FAINSTAD: My pleasure, Lulu.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Tell me a little bit about how things have been. Have you been in contact with a COVID-19 patient?
FAINSTAD: Sure. Yeah, I haven't been personally taking care of the one COVID-positive patient that we've confirmed at our hospital. And for obvious reasons, it's been a bit chaotic at our hospital, mostly around trying to consolidate information and policy as we're learning more and more every day and trying to adjust. It's creating a lot of uncertainty.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: I can imagine. And explain a little bit about what's been happening at home.
FAINSTAD: Yeah, my wife is a primary care doctor in Seattle. And she had new symptoms that would be potentially consistent with COVID-19 and, following UW and CDC guidelines, has remained away from work and probably won't return until at least 24 to 72 hours after the cough resolves.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Has she been tested?
FAINSTAD: No. That's been a real struggle. She's young and healthy. We're not concerned about her health. We're not concerned about the health of our kids and myself. But we want to be careful about participating in the spread of the virus. We don't want to be vector within our community, and we certainly don't want to expose our vulnerable patients. So it's nice to know whether you're positive because you can be even more rigorous with your quarantine practice.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: I was reading a report from The New York Times that 40 health care workers who came into contact with one patient who may have tested positive for COVID-19 went into quarantine - 40 health care workers. And that seems to me to be unsustainable and could jeopardize the resilience of the health care system.
FAINSTAD: Yeah, I think that is a very real concern that we have. And we don't want to have a disproportionate response to a positive test. And I think that probably plays into the calculus of our hospital systems deciding to or to not broadly test, even if there were testing perfectly available. And we just don't know enough about how infectious it is at the pre-symptomatic, symptomatic or post-symptomatic periods. And I agree with you - COVID-19 is a real concern. But to be honest, there is a lot of non-COVID-19 health needs in our community. And we don't want to reduce our health care staff capacity at the risk of not being able to help people with other conditions.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Are you surprised by how this has really shown some weaknesses in the American health care system?
FAINSTAD: Yes. It's, in many ways, a perfect storm. Our government response obviously hasn't satisfied the immediate needs of our population, and I think that could probably be viewed more than one way. You know, it could be demonstrating the limits of centralized government. But at the same time, the CDC has been defunded over years, and a centralized response to an epidemiologic threat like this is only as good as the policy's staffing and funding behind it.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And how's your wife doing? When do you think she might be able to be tested?
FAINSTAD: Yeah. You know, I don't know. UW virology lab reported just yesterday that they're capable of testing a thousand people a day. And then - you know, that very well may be true from a lab standpoint. But from a point-of-care standpoint, it hasn't happened. And there's staffing and resource limitations outside of what the lab itself can do. So I don't know. I wish I did.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: That's Dr. Brandon Fainstad speaking to us from near Seattle.
Thank you very much.
FAINSTAD: You're welcome. Thank you.
Copyright © 2020 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.


npr--2020-03-08--Combating Fear And Disinformation Regarding The 2020 Census

Combating Fear And Disinformation Regarding The 2020 Census A social media post has warned African Americans to not participate in the 2020 census .
NPR 's Lulu Garcia-Navarro talks with Jeri Green , a senior census advisor at the National Urban League about it .
A false message aimed at black people went viral across Facebook feeds this past week .
It told African Americans to beware the 2020 census .
The post warned that their personal information would be shared with the government .
That misleading post has since been taken down , but it tapped into a real @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Green is a senior census adviser at the National Urban League , and we brought her in to talk about this .
Welcome to the program .
JERI GREEN : Thank you very much .
It 's a pleasure to be here .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : So you probably have n't seen that particular Facebook post , but to be clear , personal information from the census is not shared with the government .
GREEN : Absolutely not .
Your answers are kept anonymous .
They 're only used to produce statistics .
And @ @ @ @ @ @ @ - Title 13 , U.S. code - to keep those responses strictly confidential .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : This is a real worry for black people , right ?
Why is it a concern ?
Why are these privacy issues a particular issue ?
GREEN : You know , the Census Bureau conducted a study to find out what the barriers are within our communities , across communities - black , brown , Asian .
And African Americans in particular had the greatest amount of fear about the census .
And there 's fear that @ @ @ @ @ @ @ with law enforcement officials or parole officers .
It 's just that we 're on the periphery of society .
We 're holding on .
And every day , you know - sometimes in our communities , we feel that our grasp on , you know , what everybody else wants in life is more and more threatened .
So why share that information ?
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Is there a lot of disinformation around the census ?
Do you see that ?
GREEN : Yes , we do .
We 've already seen @ @ @ @ @ @ @ a fundraising tool and put out a false and misleading census questionnaire to fundraise .
And we do believe that we 're going to see more of it - more disinformation , more misinformation about the census .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : So what are the solutions being put in place to combat this ?
I mean , what are you doing ?
And also , what is the Census Bureau doing , if anything ?
GREEN : Well , the Census Bureau has put up a disinformation page .
But we are - we @ @ @ @ @ @ @ All of us are fighting disinformation .
And we 're - what we have to do is educate our community about the importance of the census , how it impacts every day of their lives for the next 10 years and how our communities will have to live with the results .
If we do n't show up , we 're invisible .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Jeri Green is a senior census adviser at the National Urban League .
Thank you so much .
GREEN : You 're welcome .
Thank you .
GARCIA-NAVARRO @ @ @ @ @ @ @ a national teleconference on March 10 to discuss the 2020 census .
You can find out more at makeblackcount.org .

Combating Fear And Disinformation Regarding The 2020 Census
A Facebook post has warned African Americans to not participate in the census. NPR's Lulu Garcia-Navarro talks with Jeri Green, from the National Urban League, about efforts to combat disinformation.
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, HOST:
A false message aimed at black people went viral across Facebook feeds this past week. It told African Americans to beware the 2020 census. The post warned that their personal information would be shared with the government. That misleading post has since been taken down, but it tapped into a real concern among the black community.
Jeri Green is a senior census adviser at the National Urban League, and we brought her in to talk about this. Welcome to the program.
JERI GREEN: Thank you very much. It's a pleasure to be here.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: So you probably haven't seen that particular Facebook post, but to be clear, personal information from the census is not shared with the government.
GREEN: Absolutely not. Your answers are kept anonymous. They're only used to produce statistics. And the Census Bureau is bound by law - Title 13, U.S. code - to keep those responses strictly confidential.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: This is a real worry for black people, right? Why is it a concern? Why are these privacy issues a particular issue?
GREEN: You know, the Census Bureau conducted a study to find out what the barriers are within our communities, across communities - black, brown, Asian. And African Americans in particular had the greatest amount of fear about the census. And there's fear that the Census Bureau might share your information with law enforcement officials or parole officers. It's just that we're on the periphery of society. We're holding on. And every day, you know - sometimes in our communities, we feel that our grasp on, you know, what everybody else wants in life is more and more threatened. So why share that information?
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Is there a lot of disinformation around the census? Do you see that?
GREEN: Yes, we do. We've already seen the Republican Party use the census as a fundraising tool and put out a false and misleading census questionnaire to fundraise. And we do believe that we're going to see more of it - more disinformation, more misinformation about the census.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: So what are the solutions being put in place to combat this? I mean, what are you doing? And also, what is the Census Bureau doing, if anything?
GREEN: Well, the Census Bureau has put up a disinformation page. But we are - we have a coalition of census stakeholders. All of us are fighting disinformation. And we're - what we have to do is educate our community about the importance of the census, how it impacts every day of their lives for the next 10 years and how our communities will have to live with the results. If we don't show up, we're invisible.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Jeri Green is a senior census adviser at the National Urban League. Thank you so much.
GREEN: You're welcome. Thank you.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: The National Urban League is hosting a national teleconference on March 10 to discuss the 2020 census. You can find out more at makeblackcount.org.
[POST-BROADCAST CLARIFICATION: In this story, we characterize the Facebook post as having gone "viral." We have been unable to verify the actual reach of the post.]
Copyright © 2020 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.


npr--2020-03-08--Utah's Lt. Gov. Spencer Cox Talks About Efforts To Deal With Coronavirus

Utah 's Lt. Gov .
Spencer Cox Talks About Efforts To Deal With Coronavirus Here in the United States , we 're watching a growing number of states report their first cases of the coronavirus - Minnesota , Oklahoma , Kentucky , Nebraska and more , including Utah .
Utah Lieutenant Governor Spencer Cox heads his state 's coronavirus task force , and he joins me now .
Welcome to the program .
SPENCER COX : Thank you , Lulu .
It 's great to be with you .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Do you know how this case got to Utah @ @ @ @ @ @ @ track who that patient has been in contact with ?
COX : Yes , we do .
Many people by now are familiar with the Princess cruise ship that is docked off the coast of California , holding many infected passengers .
This person was part of the previous group on that same cruise ship , and she had been sick for several days .
And so we do know where it came from .
The latter question - how many people has that person been in contact with ?
- we are @ @ @ @ @ @ @ that the person did go to their health care provider on two occasions .
And so we are working closely with the health care provider to see if anyone there was infected and , of course , doing the investigatory work , contacting all people who 've had contact with that individual over the past week .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : One of the problems nationwide has been the testing started so slowly in this country .
And it 's hard to contain a virus if you ca n't track it quickly .
COX : @ @ @ @ @ @ @ is that the testing standards have been loosened recently , and more tests have been made available .
So we do have the capacity now to begin moderate testing here in the state from people who have had direct contact or traveled to areas that we know there is rapid spread of the virus and are exhibiting symptoms .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Moderate testing - I mean , how many test kits are available to you , and how are you determining who gets tested ?
COX : So we have 400 test kits @ @ @ @ @ @ @ week .
We expect to have more next week and expanding testing into the private sector as well .
We , like other states , are following the guidelines that have been given .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Four hundred - that does n't seem like very much out of 3 million people in Utah .
COX : Yeah .
No .
Trust me .
We want more .
We 've asked for more , and we have been told we will be getting more this week .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Your task force has been @ @ @ @ @ @ @ of Utah about the coronavirus and the illness it causes called COVID-19 .
I have to ask about one part of that campaign - a tweet urging people not to go to work if they 're sick and calling out President Trump for spreading disinformation when he said , quote , `` We have thousands or hundreds of thousands of people that get better just by sitting around and even going to work .
Some of them go to work , but they get better . ''
You ordered the tweet deleted .
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ 's really important in our response that we take politics out of this completely .
And that was a tweet that a staffer put out , but it - completely accurate .
And we want to be completely accurate on this .
We - people need to stay home , and I think the president also said that after those comments went viral .
My point was just this .
Let 's not get into the politics of this .
If we want to be the trusted source for all of this , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ information .
And the best information is that if you are exhibiting any symptoms of this illness that you do need to stay home .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : But how challenging is it at a time when people are so concerned and you are obviously trying to get accurate information out to the people of Utah ?
I mean , the president has called the WHO 's current estimate of the death rate from COVID-19 false and that he had a hunch it was way lower .
Just the other day , he said @ @ @ @ @ @ @ be tested , which we know is not true .
I mean , how are you dealing with lines like those , which may lead someone in Utah to think the illness is less severe than it may be ?
COX : Sure .
What we 're doing is we are putting out daily accurate information .
We want everyone to know what is happening .
There 's a lot of information out there .
What we 're attempting to do is to be the trusted source of information for the people of @ @ @ @ @ @ @ tune everything else out , go to our social media , our website and get the most accurate and up-to-date information .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : And just in the interest of getting people accurate information , what is your website so that people can check it out ?
COX : Of course - coronavirus.utah.gov .
You can also follow us on social media @ utahcoronavirus .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : That 's Lieutenant Governor Spencer Cox of Utah .
Thank you very much .

Utah's Lt. Gov. Spencer Cox Talks About Efforts To Deal With Coronavirus
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, HOST:
Here in the United States, we're watching a growing number of states report their first cases of the coronavirus - Minnesota, Oklahoma, Kentucky, Nebraska and more, including Utah. Utah Lieutenant Governor Spencer Cox heads his state's coronavirus task force, and he joins me now.
Welcome to the program.
SPENCER COX: Thank you, Lulu. It's great to be with you.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Do you know how this case got to Utah and if you've been able to track who that patient has been in contact with?
COX: Yes, we do. Many people by now are familiar with the Princess cruise ship that is docked off the coast of California, holding many infected passengers. This person was part of the previous group on that same cruise ship, and she had been sick for several days. And so we do know where it came from.
The latter question - how many people has that person been in contact with? - we are investigating that currently. We do know that the person did go to their health care provider on two occasions. And so we are working closely with the health care provider to see if anyone there was infected and, of course, doing the investigatory work, contacting all people who've had contact with that individual over the past week.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: One of the problems nationwide has been the testing started so slowly in this country. And it's hard to contain a virus if you can't track it quickly.
COX: That is correct. The good news is that the testing standards have been loosened recently, and more tests have been made available. So we do have the capacity now to begin moderate testing here in the state from people who have had direct contact or traveled to areas that we know there is rapid spread of the virus and are exhibiting symptoms.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Moderate testing - I mean, how many test kits are available to you, and how are you determining who gets tested?
COX: So we have 400 test kits that were made available to us this week. We expect to have more next week and expanding testing into the private sector as well. We, like other states, are following the guidelines that have been given.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Four hundred - that doesn't seem like very much out of 3 million people in Utah.
COX: Yeah. No. Trust me. We want more. We've asked for more, and we have been told we will be getting more this week.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Your task force has been using social media to inform the people of Utah about the coronavirus and the illness it causes called COVID-19. I have to ask about one part of that campaign - a tweet urging people not to go to work if they're sick and calling out President Trump for spreading disinformation when he said, quote, "We have thousands or hundreds of thousands of people that get better just by sitting around and even going to work. Some of them go to work, but they get better." You ordered the tweet deleted. Why?
COX: Well, it's really important in our response that we take politics out of this completely. And that was a tweet that a staffer put out, but it - completely accurate. And we want to be completely accurate on this. We - people need to stay home, and I think the president also said that after those comments went viral. My point was just this. Let's not get into the politics of this. If we want to be the trusted source for all of this, let's give good information and accurate information. And the best information is that if you are exhibiting any symptoms of this illness that you do need to stay home.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: But how challenging is it at a time when people are so concerned and you are obviously trying to get accurate information out to the people of Utah? I mean, the president has called the WHO's current estimate of the death rate from COVID-19 false and that he had a hunch it was way lower. Just the other day, he said anyone who wants to be tested can be tested, which we know is not true. I mean, how are you dealing with lines like those, which may lead someone in Utah to think the illness is less severe than it may be?
COX: Sure. What we're doing is we are putting out daily accurate information. We want everyone to know what is happening. There's a lot of information out there. What we're attempting to do is to be the trusted source of information for the people of the state of Utah so they can tune everything else out, go to our social media, our website and get the most accurate and up-to-date information.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And just in the interest of getting people accurate information, what is your website so that people can check it out?
COX: Of course - coronavirus.utah.gov. You can also follow us on social media @utahcoronavirus.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: That's Lieutenant Governor Spencer Cox of Utah. Thank you very much.
COX: Thank you.
Copyright © 2020 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.


npr--2020-03-08--Remembering CC, The Cloned Cat

Remembering CC, The Cloned Cat

C.C .
the cat has died in Texas at the ripe old age of 18 .
She was the first cloned pet , genetically identical to her donor but with a friendlier disposition and a differently patterned coat .
The world of science has lost a pioneer .
DUANE KRAEMER : Some people named her Copy Cat , some Carbon Copy , some Cloned Cat .
As far as I 'm concerned , her name is C.C .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : C.C .
died last week in Texas at the age of 18 .
KRAEMER : So many people were interested @ @ @ @ @ @ @ written about her .
She was the biggest news story ever out of Texas A & M .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Sure , Dolly , the cloned sheep , was created five years earlier .
But C.C ... KRAEMER : She was the first cloned pet .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : That 's Dr. Duane Kraemer , a biomedical scientist at Texas A & M and part of the team that created C.C .
Dr. Kraemer eventually adopted Copy Cat and set her up `` Golden Girls '' -style in a two-story cat loft that had @ @ @ @ @ @ @ running water .
C.C .
's origin story goes back to 2001 and Dr. Kraemer 's lab .
KRAEMER : We took some cells from Rainbow .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Another cat in his lab .
KRAEMER : We gave them some electrical shocks .
And then when they grew in our petri dishes , we transferred them into recipient females .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Surrogate mothers .
C.C .
developed as any normal cat fetus would but was soon a celebrity .
KRAEMER : When she was born , we put her into a @ @ @ @ @ @ @ .
That picture of C.C .
in that beaker was a very , very popular request from the media from all over the world .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Once she bloomed as a kitten , people wanted to know just how identical C.C .
was to her clone mama , Rainbow .
KRAEMER : If you clone a cat , it acts like a cat .
But it 'll have its own cat personality depending on its environment .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Whatever her personality , C.C .
had her own look , too , @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Rainbow because while the two cats may have shared the same genes , not all the genes were activated .
Dr. Kraemer has kept some of C.C .
's DNA just in case someday there is ever a reason to clone her again .
But he says it would only be for scientific - never for sentimental - reasons .
KRAEMER : We do n't really need more cats .
I encourage people to go to the pound and adopt a cat .
GARCIA-NAVARRO : Because , he says , a clone of @ @ @ @ @ @ @ as the original .

Remembering CC, The Cloned Cat
C.C. the cat has died in Texas at the ripe old age of 18. She was the first cloned pet, genetically identical to her donor but with a friendlier disposition and a differently patterned coat.
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, HOST:
The world of science has lost a pioneer.
DUANE KRAEMER: Some people named her Copy Cat, some Carbon Copy, some Cloned Cat. As far as I'm concerned, her name is C.C.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: C.C. died last week in Texas at the age of 18.
KRAEMER: So many people were interested in her. So many stories were written about her. She was the biggest news story ever out of Texas A&M.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Sure, Dolly, the cloned sheep, was created five years earlier. But C.C...
KRAEMER: She was the first cloned pet.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: That's Dr. Duane Kraemer, a biomedical scientist at Texas A&M and part of the team that created C.C. Dr. Kraemer eventually adopted Copy Cat and set her up "Golden Girls"-style in a two-story cat loft that had a caged patio, air conditioning and running water. C.C.'s origin story goes back to 2001 and Dr. Kraemer's lab.
KRAEMER: We took some cells from Rainbow.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Another cat in his lab.
KRAEMER: We gave them some electrical shocks. And then when they grew in our petri dishes, we transferred them into recipient females.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Surrogate mothers. C.C. developed as any normal cat fetus would but was soon a celebrity.
KRAEMER: When she was born, we put her into a beaker and took a picture of her. That picture of C.C. in that beaker was a very, very popular request from the media from all over the world.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Once she bloomed as a kitten, people wanted to know just how identical C.C. was to her clone mama, Rainbow.
KRAEMER: If you clone a cat, it acts like a cat. But it'll have its own cat personality depending on its environment.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Whatever her personality, C.C. had her own look, too, with more orange in her fur than Rainbow because while the two cats may have shared the same genes, not all the genes were activated. Dr. Kraemer has kept some of C.C.'s DNA just in case someday there is ever a reason to clone her again. But he says it would only be for scientific - never for sentimental - reasons.
KRAEMER: We don't really need more cats. I encourage people to go to the pound and adopt a cat.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Because, he says, a clone of your pet will never be the same as the original.
Copyright © 2020 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.


npr--2020-03-08--Schools And Businesses Grapple With How To Cope With Coronavirus

Schools And Businesses Grapple With How To Cope With Coronavirus Schools and businesses are hiring industrial cleaning companies to prevent coronavirus infection but it may be most valuable as a confidence measure .
As the number of confirmed coronavirus cases grows , schools and businesses are trying to cope .
And many are resorting to deep cleaning , some going as far as hiring industrial crews to sanitize their facilities .
As NPR 's Sarah McCammon reports , there are limits to that approach .
SARAH MCCAMMON , BYLINE : The last few days have not been the smoothest for @ @ @ @ @ @ @ not our normal week .
MCCAMMON : Degnan is 45 and the owner of So-Ca , a restaurant in Raleigh , N.C. His week took a turn when county officials told him the one person in the state with a confirmed coronavirus case at that time had recently dined in his restaurant .
DEGNAN : It 's not the lottery that I wanted to win .
MCCAMMON : So Degnan and his staff sprang into action , spending hours cleaning every surface , every plate , every last knife and fork .
He @ @ @ @ @ @ @ that the restaurant was safe .
DEGNAN : Some of it 's for peace of mind for our staff .
And some of it was , what else are you going to do all day while you 're waiting to see what 's going to happen ?
You might as well sit there and clean and make yourself feel better about the situation .
MCCAMMON : The next day , Degnan brought in a commercial company at a cost of a few hundred dollars to do another round of cleaning and disinfecting in @ @ @ @ @ @ @ or suspected cases of coronavirus in their communities are taking a similar approach .
After a student at Everett Public Schools outside Seattle tested positive more than a week ago , a large crew of custodial and maintenance workers spent a long weekend deep cleaning , says spokeswoman Kathy Reeves .
KATHY REEVES : They spent three days disinfecting all touchable surfaces .
MCCAMMON : Reeves said it 's tough to estimate the price tag for the district , both in supplies and staff time .
And the figure may keep going up @ @ @ @ @ @ @ around the country , says Francisco Negron , chief legal officer at the National School Boards Association .
His group is getting lots of questions about how to deal with coronavirus .
And Negron says there are many factors for administrators to consider .
FRANCISCO NEGRON : I do n't think schools are going to be concerned with overspending .
I think the primary concern of schools is making sure that their students and their school communities are safe .
MCCAMMON : Negron is urging school districts to ask their insurance companies for @ @ @ @ @ @ @ : It could be thousands of dollars , depending on the situation that you 're looking at .
MCCAMMON : Patty Olinger is with the cleaning industry association ISSA .
She says the costs can vary depending on the size and scope of what 's required .
OLINGER : Is it a warehouse , or is it an office building ?
Is it a school system , or is it a day care ?
Is it a hotel where you also have to deal with the bedding , potentially ?
And so that @ @ @ @ @ @ @ MCCAMMON : Angela Rasmussen , a virologist at Columbia University , says deep cleaning ca n't hurt , but it can only help so much .
ANGELA RASMUSSEN : Because we have n't been able to test as widely as a number of other countries , we do n't really have a good understanding of what the prevalence is right now in the population .
So deep cleaning once if you know that you had a confirmed case come in is great .
But there 's still a risk that another infected person @ @ @ @ @ @ @ do n't know what you do .
MCCAMMON : For Sean Degnan , the restaurant owner in Raleigh , his business is slowly coming back after the coronavirus scare .
And he says there 's at least one benefit to all this cleanliness .
DEGNAN : I mean , we 're also due for a health inspection , so it 's kind of ( laughter ) good timing for that .
MCCAMMON : Because even if it ca n't stop the coronavirus , a good cleaning never hurt anyone .

Schools And Businesses Grapple With How To Cope With Coronavirus
Schools and businesses are hiring industrial cleaning companies to prevent coronavirus infection but it may be most valuable as a confidence measure.
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, HOST:
As the number of confirmed coronavirus cases grows, schools and businesses are trying to cope. And many are resorting to deep cleaning, some going as far as hiring industrial crews to sanitize their facilities. As NPR's Sarah McCammon reports, there are limits to that approach.
SARAH MCCAMMON, BYLINE: The last few days have not been the smoothest for Sean Degnan.
SEAN DEGNAN: Certainly not our normal week.
MCCAMMON: Degnan is 45 and the owner of So-Ca, a restaurant in Raleigh, N.C. His week took a turn when county officials told him the one person in the state with a confirmed coronavirus case at that time had recently dined in his restaurant.
DEGNAN: It's not the lottery that I wanted to win.
MCCAMMON: So Degnan and his staff sprang into action, spending hours cleaning every surface, every plate, every last knife and fork. He wanted to reassure his customers and employees that the restaurant was safe.
DEGNAN: Some of it's for peace of mind for our staff. And some of it was, what else are you going to do all day while you're waiting to see what's going to happen? You might as well sit there and clean and make yourself feel better about the situation.
MCCAMMON: The next day, Degnan brought in a commercial company at a cost of a few hundred dollars to do another round of cleaning and disinfecting in the restaurant.
Many schools with confirmed or suspected cases of coronavirus in their communities are taking a similar approach. After a student at Everett Public Schools outside Seattle tested positive more than a week ago, a large crew of custodial and maintenance workers spent a long weekend deep cleaning, says spokeswoman Kathy Reeves.
KATHY REEVES: They spent three days disinfecting all touchable surfaces.
MCCAMMON: Reeves said it's tough to estimate the price tag for the district, both in supplies and staff time. And the figure may keep going up.
That's a concern for schools around the country, says Francisco Negron, chief legal officer at the National School Boards Association. His group is getting lots of questions about how to deal with coronavirus. And Negron says there are many factors for administrators to consider.
FRANCISCO NEGRON: I don't think schools are going to be concerned with overspending. I think the primary concern of schools is making sure that their students and their school communities are safe.
MCCAMMON: Negron is urging school districts to ask their insurance companies for help with the costs.
PATTY OLINGER: It could be thousands of dollars, depending on the situation that you're looking at.
MCCAMMON: Patty Olinger is with the cleaning industry association ISSA. She says the costs can vary depending on the size and scope of what's required.
OLINGER: Is it a warehouse, or is it an office building? Is it a school system, or is it a day care? Is it a hotel where you also have to deal with the bedding, potentially? And so that deep clean can mean different things.
MCCAMMON: Angela Rasmussen, a virologist at Columbia University, says deep cleaning can't hurt, but it can only help so much.
ANGELA RASMUSSEN: Because we haven't been able to test as widely as a number of other countries, we don't really have a good understanding of what the prevalence is right now in the population. So deep cleaning once if you know that you had a confirmed case come in is great. But there's still a risk that another infected person could come in. And then I don't know what you do.
MCCAMMON: For Sean Degnan, the restaurant owner in Raleigh, his business is slowly coming back after the coronavirus scare. And he says there's at least one benefit to all this cleanliness.
DEGNAN: I mean, we're also due for a health inspection, so it's kind of (laughter) good timing for that.
MCCAMMON: Because even if it can't stop the coronavirus, a good cleaning never hurt anyone.
Sarah McCammon, NPR News.
Copyright © 2020 NPR. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.